Just over a week has passed since Adobe released the CC 2015.2 and 6.2 updates, and it’s been a tough week for the entire Lightroom community, from the Lightroom team right through to the users who have had their work disrupted.
The thread about the new Import dialog shot to the top of the listing on the Feedback forum in record time, primarily due to missing Import functionality that broke the workflows of many advanced and professional users. Forums do tend to give a distorted view of how people are feeling, as happy users have no reason to post, but even so, I’ve never experienced a response like it.
Adobe Apologizes
On Friday, Tom Hogarty made a public apology, admitting they’d made some bad decisions with this release and promising to “work hard to earn your trust back.”
To be fair, we’ve all made mistakes. Adobe may be a big corporation but it’s made up of imperfect humans. We all make bad decisions at times, and unfortunately this one affected a large number of people. What’s important now is what they do next.
So what’s happening with Import?
The short answer is “we don’t know what’s going to happen with Import yet.” The immediate priority was the stability issues, and now Adobe will be figuring out exactly how to integrate all of the feedback they’ve received. That’s going to take time – possibly even 2 or 3 months – but that doesn’t mean you’re being ignored. Your feedback has been heard loud and clear.
I’m on TheFix podcast
To hear a little more about this week’s events and the new Import dialog, you can catch me on episode 35 of The FIX podcast with Sean Duggan this week. It should be available to watch later today.
Is it safe to upgrade now?
On Friday, Adobe released the CC 2015.2.1 /6.2.1 updates, which appear to have solved many of the crash and performance issues.
Some users are still seeing stability problems, particularly having to force quit the application, and the team are investigating these leftover issues.
There are a couple of other smaller bugs that have been discovered in these updates and they will be fixed in due course, and they have easy workarounds noted on the linked threads:
- Applying Auto Tone while importing photos turns previews black
- Synchronize Folders isn’t working correctly if the ‘Show import dialog before importing’ checkbox is unchecked and the selected folder contains subfolders.
On a production machine, I’d recommend staying with 2015.1.1 / 6.1.1 for now, until things settle down, although the number of users continuing to see issues is now comparatively small.
If you do decide to upgrade and then get stuck, it’s quite simple to downgrade using these instructions.
Book updates – and a free download or two
As the new Import dialog looks nothing like the old one, I’ve rewritten the Import chapter of my book. For registered LRCC/6 book owners, it’s been available for download in the Members Area for the last few days.
Since so many people are trying to figure out the new Import dialog, I’ve decided to help by making my new Import chapter available for ALL of my newsletter subscribers for the next couple of weeks.
To download it, enter your name and email address into the Newsletter Signup form (see the sidebar or below this post on a mobile device). If you’re a new subscriber, click the link in the confirmation email to access the download. If you’re already subscribed, the link to the download page displays in the signup form when you click Sign Me Up!
Putting the new Import dialog into my free Quick Start eBook has given me the opportunity to do a number of other updates to the eBook at the same time. I’m on course to have this finished by the weekend and will send all subscribers an updated download link as soon as it’s ready.
So this is really my fault for upgrading without checking? Couldn’t disagree more – Scott Kelby got the tone right in his blog this AM – Adobe needs to get back to the old user group testing regime so these issues are dealt with before we even are aware of them. I am betting this is the beginning of a long slow decline for Adobe – we will look back in five years and see this as the moment where everything changed and folks migrated to an as yet small but more more nimble and equally robust platform. They blew it.
Nooooooo, I wouldn’t say that at all Phil! However I’ve spoken to a lot of people this week who suddenly discovered they couldn’t tether their cameras (due to Nikon, not Adobe) because they’d upgraded to El Capitan without checking first, so this debacle is a good reminder to check compatibility carefully when upgrading, especially when you can’t afford any downtime.
But this release should never have made it out the door, no question. I’ve said that from the start.
I hope when you update your chapter to the new workflow that you don’t discard the workflow for the old import dialog – as a lot of us are not going to upgrade to the dumbed down version, at least not right away or until forced into it by other worthwhile advances. Meanwhile you would think Adobe could just offer a Preference – Full Import Dialog or Streamlined Import Dialog.
No, don’t worry Carol. In the main book, the old Import is still there and the new Import is a separate downloadable appendix. I haven’t decided how to handle the quick start ebook, as that’s primarily designed for new users, but one way or another, both import dialogs will be available.
Color me lost, but where is the new Import? Is it part of the Quick Start download? So I would have
to download that even if I did not want it? While I’m at it, is the Quick Start download the same as
the quick start chapter in your book ?
Dale
Victoria,
I have a question that’s been puzzling me. According to Adobe, only the CC version of LR will get new and improved features between major releases and the Perpetual License (PL) version will only get new cameras and bug fixes. Indeed, “Dehaze” showec up in CC but not in PL versions.
So, why did the new Import Dialog find it’s way into both the PL and the CC version? This must certainly be considered a new or improved feature as the old Import Dialog was not broken and was not buggy so I don’t see why the PL version go this “quote” improvement after Adobe explaining over and over that the PL versions would not get such “improvements”.
Thanks — dan
They’ve considered it a facelift to an existing feature, rather than a new feature, which is why they were able to put it into both versions. In terms of the accounting rules, I understand it’s a question of whether users would consider the feature has a financial value – and as it turns out, many users are of the opinion that it has no value whatsoever!
Ok, I found the answer to the first question, and am printing it right now. I’ll rephrase the second question. Is the Quick Start guide available from Amazon the same as the quick start chapter in the awesome FAQ book ?
Dale
Well done Dale. The LR5 Quick Start eBook is very similar to the quick start chapter in the LR5 book, and the LRCC/6 Quick Start is an updated/expanded version of that. In the LRCC/6 book, the quick start information threads right the way through the book, rather than being a separate chapter, and is expanded with additional information.
So in short, if you’ve got my main FAQ book, you don’t need the free Quick Start.
Victoria,
Considering the accounting regulations you are recently discussing, I would like to clarify that no accounting regulation I can think of ever prevents a company from doing anything strategically or tactically nor does it require a company to do anything strategically or tactically. Instead, the accounting regulations simply require financial results to be reported in a particular way. A good example, ironically, is Adobe’s decision to migrate from a perpetual license-based model to a subscription-based model. Adobe’s management did an excellent job of explaining to investors that doing so would negatively affect reported net earnings in the short to medium term and the results have proven them to be correct about that.
My point is that the accounting regulations are not a tail that wags the dog, as I’m concerned that uninformed readers of this and the previous thread might inaccurately come to believe. Adobe management is always the dog that wags the tail. If management wants to change a strategy or tactic that they believe is in their customers’ best interest, they can always do that regardless of how the accounting regulations require the results of that change to be reported.
Hope this helps clarify things.
Thanks Mike! I don’t claim to even start to understand Sarbanes Oxley and US and international accounting standards, there’s an experienced accountant on this thread who goes into more detail, for those who are interested: http://clkuk.tradedoubler.com/click?p(265883)a(2791170)g(22913796)url(https://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/why-is-adobe-treating-subscription-clients-and-software-buyers-differently)
Victoria,
I watched “The FIX” podcast. Thank you for taking the time to do it. It’s obvious you fully understand the frustrations and the reasons for them by both professional and experienced photographers as well as the fledgling ones who hope to move up. In short, You “get it”.
For me, the comment “Keeping the existing Import experience isn’t an option, and we needed to evolve the Import experience.” made by Sharad Mangalick was the one that irked me the most. In essence it came across as if you don’t like it, too bad. Accept what we give you and like it. Other than an apology from Tom Hogarty there has been little or no word from Adobe saying what they will do about the problem. It would be nice to hear them actually say they’re going to reinstate the missing functions regardless of the timeframe it might take to do so. I didn’t “upgrade” so I”m not affected by the change. Yet. I along with thousands of users have spend thousands of hours and significant sums to acquire Lightroom and instructional material. We’re invested. I’d like to know if I can stay invested or need to just move on now rather than later if Adobe isn’t going to commit to giving us back the tools we need to use our preferred workflows. If they’re not I’d just as know now so I can go about making other arrangements with other software. I’d also like to hear them say that they won’t do something so one-sided and arbitrary again.
I understand it may take months to fix the problem. It would only take minutes to assure the customer base that the features they want back will indeed be put back. Again, thanks for being a voice of reason in this debacle. “The FIX” podcast should be required watching for anyone negatively affected by this problem.
Thanks Guy, I really appreciate that. I’ve been very privileged to work with a huge variety of photographers over the years, so I can see the situation from a lot of different angles. Plus I’ve had a number of weeks to get over the shock!
Sharad’s post didn’t come over anything like he intended. He was trying to explain what they were trying to accomplish, but it came over badly, especially considering everyone was already really angry. Tom has a bit more experience in understanding how things will be read.
I know it feels like they’re taking ages to come back with an answer, but I’d take that as a good sign that they’re really taking everyone’s comments on board and thinking it through properly rather than digging their heels in.
A number of the key players, including Tom and Jeff, were at the Adobe Max conference last week, so they’d have been aware of what was happening but they wouldn’t have been able to follow all of the discussion. That’s been a full time job! The engineers have obviously been busy trying to track down and fix the stability problems, so it’s only really been the last few days they’ve been able to start discussing their options properly.
Tom updated his post to say “With 432 comments and counting I just wanted to let folks know that I’m reading all of the feedback and the team will provide an update this week.”
FWIW, I don’t think you need to worry about your investment. They can’t ignore such a huge outcry. And while it’s been a nightmare for everyone, the silver lining is it’s been a really good wake up call for them.
I also watched The Fix – something I have never done before. I’m not a big video interview watcher. My preference is written tutorials with some screen shot support. But given that I am not going to be upgrading to 6.2 any time soon and I really wanted to see what the improved import experience was like. Therefore the episode of The Fix seemed like a good interview to watch.
Nicely done. A good sane discussion with a nice description of the new import functionality (it is much more than a dialog). Previously I was a bit nervous based on the full on hate of the new import functionality that the whole thing was bad. Clear it is not.
There are two separate issues that I see in the discussion and two often I see them getting conflated which makes things seem even worse.
1) they removed functionality that broke people’s existing work flow with no real warning.
2) the introduced a newly designed UI for importing.
While it is true that any time something like #2 happens people get upset because their cheese got moved. The vast majority of the time we get over it and find the new cheese locations and adapt. What I saw form your demo was that the concept and design are actually quite good. New and even many experience users will be able to make good use of that design. On top of that those of us with sightly more complex workflows or with a more “it is always the same” workflow and just want to make sure the files are going where we expect have the tools right there to get to the moved cheese. You can dispense with the opening screen and expose the detailed panels. If it were not for #1 we would just find the cheese and get back to it.
The problem is #1. Oh man total disaster. Like I just said if the functionality that was removed simply was just available in those advanced panels in the UI there would be no real issue. The issue is Adobe removed actual capabilities from the product. And they did it in the worst possible way – with no warning. My full time job is in software development. When my team develops tools for other developers to use, we view it as a contract. When we want to change our end of the contract we give people two things, a full explanation and ample warning. If something is going to be removed the first thing that happens is the old way stays in the product and the new stuff gets added. When it gets released we tell our customers we are planning in the future to get rid of features x, y and z but for this next release they all still work and the new way we want you to accomplish the work of x, y and z have been added. That gives everyone the ability to see what is coming and why. It also gives them the ability to migrate – on their own time – to the new way. On top of which any short comings in the new plan can be discovered.
Mind you, having said that the features that were removed from Lightroom seemed just arbitrary and to date I have seen no explanation that makes any sense for why they were removed (BTW some bogus secret analytical platitude does not count as a sensible reason, IMHO).
The way I see it Adobe could have executed this with basically no fuss at all. The new direction for the import functionality seems just fine and they even had the place that the removed functionality could have been controlled and can be replaced. The problem I still have is that there is still no stated commitment to fixing the workflow they broke. None of this is rocket science the answer is pretty straight forward – add the removed functionality into the already existing advanced panels.
Now where the two problems get intermingled is when people say “you broke it put the old dialog back” (because we are end users can just want our cheese back) the response is “there is no way we are going back, sorry we messed with your cheese we have heard your concerns and will address them”. The problem comes because most people cannot see what a few of us can – that the removed features can be knitted into the new design concept. We do not actually need them to “go back” they can keep their improved design and restore people’s work flow.
Thanks for taking the time to watch Ian. You’re absolutely right about the two separate issues. They’ve just announced that they’re putting the old dialog back. I wouldn’t be surprised we didn’t see something like the new look again in future, but I’d hope that they’ve learned a good lesson about removing functionality.
Yes, I saw that. I was a bit surprised though. I figured they would just add the removed functionality to the existing advanced version of the dialog. I suppose this was the faster way to make everyone whose work flow was broken whole while they come up with a way to do that.
I just hope they do a good job of communicating what the plan is and how they are going to address everyone’s needs. Including hopefully getting some pros who used those features to try it out before hand. Fingers crossed.
Thank you for being on top of this and sharing what you found out so early. It really saved me from the hassle of upgrading and then having to go back. I appreciate it.
Even though I’ve been using Lr since the beta beginning this is the first time I’ve stumbled onto your site and the lightroom forums. Probably as I recently subscribed to CC to get access to full photoshop and went looking for more information on how people do things.
I was on a hospital bed when 6.2 came out so I was sort of lucky and missed it. Sticking with 6.1 at the moment as the new import is problematic for me.
Totally off topic but more importantly you have 2 very happy looking dogs there and that counts for a lot in my books.
Greg
It’s great to meet you Greg, and I hope your hospital trip wasn’t anything too serious and you’re feeling better now. I’ll give my boys an extra dog biscuit for you!
Victoria, I have not yet upgraded. I was looking at your ‘The Fix’ Podcast. It was unclear to me if in the new Import functionality allows to save the Import Presets. They are a feature I use heavily and makes it would be a big miss for me. Thanks so much.
Hi Martin, yes, that’s still there – it’s just moved to the top of the Advanced panel.
Thanks Victoria. Appreciate it. m.
$9.99 vs. $10.99
As you have shown with your books, Quality and Service sell. So why didn’t they just raise the price a little for the next few years and give us better tools to sell our image related products? In my short 40+ years in manufacturing professional hand tools, I have learned the hard way that value to the customer is more important than price. If they gave us back our professional imaging tools; then added more we could use to impress our customers, we would sell their software for them. Word of mouth (on the web) is a powerful tool. Their products (and mine) are only tools. Their professional customers WILL look for other tools to do the job.
Bob G.
Thank you Bob! Let’s wait and see how carefully they’ve listened.
I am unable to download the upgrade 5 to 6. Appreciate if you could advice.
Thanks
Ramys
What kind of problem are you having exactly? Are you unable to download it from the links above? Or you’re having trouble installing? Or you haven’t purchased LR6 yet?
Looks like adobe latest update to Creative Cloud released this week has big issues.
https://forums.adobe.com/message/8488722#8488722
If you are on a mac DONT UPGRADE Creative Cloud