Workflow from Lightroom mobile for iPad to LrC on desk top

[Candia Peterson]

Lightroom Version Number

Classic 10.4

Operating System

1. macOS 11 Big Sur
2. iOS

Hi everyone

This is my first post though I have been reading and following some of the forums.

to explain my problem, I have just changed my computer arrangement from a laptop (always had a laptop) to my first desktop and I plan to edit on the run when I'm travelling using an iPad. This is partly because - Covid! - I'm not travelling as much as I used to and when I needed to upgrade my last laptop, I thought I'd try the new iMac.

I am having sync issues and I can see from the forums that many of you are having the same issues. It is getting stuck.....

I have learnt how I am supposed to sync files from the pad back to the computer - put them in an album and they should sync automatically - that isn't happening. Don't know what I'm doing wrong.

Two other questions:

1. Where do my Raw files go in terms of the catalog if I do manage to get my images downloaded to the iPad back to the desktop? Do I have assume that iPad is just for a play while I'm travelling and a bit of image selection and editing and I uplaod the files again when I get back to my desktop so I have the DNGs in my catalog?? Or does the sync - if it works - transfer the DNGs as well?? And if it does, how do I know where it has put them?

2. The sync to the iPad has taken across all my collections which I don't want or need. How do I only sync across those collections I want to have on my iPad or is this not possible?

Many thanks for helping me with this and I look forward to some answers.

 

[Jim Wilde]

Before I get round to answering your specific questions, it would probably help to fully understand the way that the cloud syncing system works, and how Classic can fit into that system.

The Lightroom ecosystem consists of a central "hub", known as the "cloud" but in reality it's a bunch of servers in San Jose (and probably other locations as well), and then the various Lightroom "client" apps. There are apps available for phones and tablets (separate apps per device type and software type), apps for Windows and MacOS computers, a web browser app, and even an Apple TV app. All the client apps sync only to the central server, so it's that server that controls the flow of images, edits, and other data to and from the clients. You can add (import) images via any of those apps and syncing (uploading) of those images in full original form is automatic. No, you do not have to "put them in an album" to get them to sync (though it might help the user to do so in order to better organise them for subsequently finding them in any of the other apps that they might be using). So, provided there is a network connection, and syncing hasn't been paused by the user, all newly added files will be uploaded automatically to the central server. From there, previews of those images will show up when the user next starts Lightroom on any of their other connected devices, and any changes made in any connected app will sync via the server to all the other apps.

Lightroom Classic can play with that ecosystem, but in a different way. For a start, syncing is not automatic and so it has to be enabled (and only one catalog can be enabled for syncing at any one time, though it is possible to switch syncing to a different catalog). Once the catalog has been sync-enabled it's important to know that ALL images that are already in the cloud server, and any subsequent imports via any of the client apps, will automatically download into that Classic catalog. That cannot be stopped once syncing is enabled (though syncing can subsequently be paused), and the downloaded images are a full copy of the originals that are in the cloud. There are stored by default in an obscure folder in a "Mobile Downloads.lrdata" package, which should appear under a "folder" in the Folders Panel which has the name of the specific device from whence they came (so if you use several different devices you'll have corresponding "folders" for each). However, on the Classic Preferences>Lightroom Sync tab you will find an option to choose a different download location, and you can even choose to use one of the standard date-based folder structures for the downloaded images. If you do use your own location you won't get separate folders per device type, just one folder structure which will encompass all downloaded images from the cloud.

Another major difference with Classic is that syncing images FROM Classic to the cloud (and thus eventually to your connected devices) is NOT automatic....the user gets to decide which images they want to be synced, and that can be done in two ways. The easiest and more organised way is to add the chosen images to a collection in Classic, and then enable that collection to sync. That will upload the images in that collection to the cloud, and they will subsequently appear on any connected device (the collection appears as an album with the same name). The other way to upload images from Classic is to simply add them to the All Synced Photographs (the ASP) special collection that will appear in the Catalog Panel in Classic.....that ASP will contain the list of all synced images (no image can be synced that does not appear in the ASP, and no image that is not synced can appear in the ASP, thus all synced images must appear in the ASP), so it logically follows that if you add an image to that collection, Classic must then upload it to the cloud. It also logically follows that if you remove an image from the ASP, then it must unsynced and thus be deleted from the cloud. That's an important rule to learn and understand.

Also of note is that unlike the Lightroom ecosystem client apps, there are restrictions on what Classic data can sync with the cloud. Keywords, Location Data, Face Tags, Presets are some things that flow across the ecosystem client apps, but do not flow between Classic and the cloud.

One final difference is that Classic only ever uploads Smart Previews of the images, it does not upload the originals. Smart Previews are proxies of the originals, and are 2560 px on the long edge. They also do not count against the user's cloud storage allowance.

I think in typing this I've probably indirectly answered your initial questions, but if you have any more don't hesitate to get back to us.

 

[Candia Peterson]

Thank you so much for your long and detailed reply. I'm not sure it has totally helped me but it does aid my understanding. As you have been so kind to devote such a lot of your time to this, I hope you won't mind if I come back.

My issues are this now.

My syncing on LrC is definintely stuck. I've gone through the process of locating sync errors using the filter and it comes back 0 photos. Nevertheless, for ages - weeks - I have the blue circle on the clour icon and it tells me it is syncing 5 photos (and in fact when you list them, there is one downloading and 5 pending. They are all from old laptops. I'd be happy just to delete these images from the sync panel but I can't seem to do that.

Then, wehn I got my new iPad, it did automatically load all my photos that are in collections in LrC - except not new ones I created in the last two weeks. I set up the iPad just in the last two days. What I would prefer is to have no LrC photos on my iPad - I don't need to take up the space - and I want my iPad to use for mobile editing and just to contain those images I've loaded from my card while I'm away from home. I did look at a YouTube video which said the way to get photos on the iPad back to LrC was to create an album but that hasn't uploaded to the desk top. I'm not sure I understand from your answer how I get the photos loaded to the iPad back to the desktop (which is really the only flow I'm interested in).

I also still don't understand where the Raw files go. When I import to LrC - I have a folder system that is organised in date order (which I know is horses for courses) but I don't know where the Raws go if I load to the iPad. I'm guessing I have to use the iPad only for looking at images while I'm away and then I load the images properly as usual from the card when I get home. I can live with that but I had hoped that the workflow would be more seamless.

I should add that we are not talking about mobile photography here. This is all photos taken on a card from a camera and loaded via a reader.

I'm starting to think I might be better off with a small laptop dedicated for photos to use when I'm away. So then the question is, can I have the same catalog on two machines?

However, I still need to get past the sync blockage and I am running out of ideas on this because it does seem to be stopping anything else.

Cheers

Candia

PS this is salient at the moment as I'm going on a away workshop next weekend and would love this workflow to be in place for then.

 

[clee01l]

Are any of these stuck images videos? Are any of these images showing as "missing" in the master Lightroom Classic Catalog? If you can locate the stuck image in Lightroom Classic and remove it from the catalog, then syncing should resume.

As for the iPad, go to Lightroom for the Web in your browser ( Online photo editor | Photoshop Lightroom ) If necessary logs into your account and chalk to see if all but the 5 pending images has made it to the cloud. If so, then all of these images should be available on your iPad running a mobile Lightroom app.

FWIW, I import all of my images from my Nikon into Lightroom on my iPadPro and they sync down to my master Lightroom Classic Catalog on my desktop.

Before there was a cloud version of Lightroom, the only ability to manage on two computers was to use the "Export to a catalog"/ "Import from another Catalog" to merge a travel catalog from/to the master catalog using Lightroom (Classic) on two computers. The process is somewhat complex and many people had problems with the catalog merge of the two catalogs. If you have not worked out your kinks between Lightroom and Lightroom Classic before your workshop, we can get you set up with Lightroom Classic on the laptop as well as a master Lightroom Classic catalog on the desktop.

When you sync FROM the Lightroom Classic Master Catalog, the RAW files stay on the desktop and proxy files are sent to the cloud and on to your mobile devices. These do not use any of your Cloud storage plan limits (e.g. 20GB or 1TB plans)

RAW files imported into Lightroom on your mobile device are sync'd full size to your cloud storage plan and will quickly fill the 20GB plan storage limit. These RAW files are then sync'd down to the Lightroom Classic Master catalog as full size RAW files. In Lightroom Classic Preferences on the Lightroom Sync tab, you can set or change the location folder(s) of the image files that come from the Adobe cloud.

 

[Jim Wilde]

I'm not sure I understand from your answer how I get the photos loaded to the iPad back to the desktop (which is really the only flow I'm interested in).

I thought I was pretty clear about this, but obviously not...so let me try again.

When you import images to your iPad (or phone, or LrWeb, or LrDesktop) they are automatically uploaded to the cloud....provided you have not paused syncing, and provided you have a network connection. It doesn't matter at all if you have or have not added those imports to an album. So all you should need to ensure is that you haven't paused syncing, and you have a network connection from your iPad.....in which case the images should automatically sync to the cloud.

I also still don't understand where the Raw files go. When I import to LrC - I have a folder system that is organised in date order (which I know is horses for courses) but I don't know where the Raws go if I load to the iPad.

As I said in my earlier response, provided sync has been enabled in the Classic catalog (and provided it's not stuck), downloading of all images that have been synced to the cloud from any of the Lightroom apps is another automatic process. There's a default location for those downloads, but the user has the option to change that on the Classic Preferences>Lightroom Sync tab. Like you, I use one of Classic's standard date-based folder schemes, so in my preferences I have set the same Parent Folder and the same dated structure as I use for all my Classic images. That way whichever app I import to, the images all end up stored in Classic the same date-based set of folders.

However, I still need to get past the sync blockage

Indeed you do. Have you tried to re build Classic's Sync Data (open Classic's Preferences>Lightroom Sync tab, press and hold the Opt key and the "Rebuild Sync Data" button will appear in the bottom half. Clicking on that will do through the process of rebuilding Classic's sync database, which often clears up syncing issues.

 

[Jim Wilde]

Then, when I got my new iPad, it did automatically load all my photos that are in collections in LrC - except not new ones I created in the last two weeks. I set up the iPad just in the last two days. What I would prefer is to have no LrC photos on my iPad - I don't need to take up the space - and I want my iPad to use for mobile editing and just to contain those images I've loaded from my card while I'm away from home.

The ONLY way that your iPad could have loaded the photos that are in collections in LrC would be if you had synced those photos from Classic to the cloud (or imported them directly into one of the other Lightroom clients), so if you don't want them on the iPad then you have to remove them from the cloud. As I said earlier, syncing between the cloud and the Lightroom clients is non-selective, so remove them from the cloud in order to remove them from the iPad.

 

[clee01l]

Indeed you do. Have you tried to re build Classic's Sync Data (open Classic's Preferences>Lightroom Sync tab, press and hold the Opt key and the "Rebuild Sync Data" button will appear in the bottom half. Clicking on that will do through the process of rebuilding Classic's sync database, which often clears up syncing issues.

I would not suggest rebuilding the sync data until you isolate and resolve any “stuck” images. Missing images and videos are often the underlying issue.

Lightroom Classic images are generally not a problem on the iPad Lightroom will manage local cache to only store locally those images that you are actively using. You can also clear the local Lightroom Cache.
I have over 10,000 images from my Lightroom Classic catalog sync’d to the cloud. Only a small number of them are available at any one time in my iPad.


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[Candia Peterson]

Thank you to everybody. II understand it better now. I still haven't resolved the stuck photos - they aren't missing in LrC but I can live with it for now until I have the strength to work it out some more. Meanwhile, the most important thing for me which is the reverse workflow is working and the images are coming back into LrC - I was just looking in the wrong place.

 

[dkinpgh1]

If I can take this a little further - While on a 2 week trip, I would load photos into LRM on my iPad Pro, which according to what I've read here, are automatically uploaded to the cloud, waiting for my return home to turn on the computer with LRC and download from those pictures from the cloud. That's what I did and as much as I can grasp now based on the responses in this thread.

My question(s) is/are: once the pictures are downloaded to the desktop LRC, what happens to the files remaining on the iPad when I try to work with them? Or, should I not work with them on the iPad? I noticed that when I did some edits on the iPad, those edits didn't seem to appear on the LRC version. Secondly, when I reopened the iPad to review the file I worked on, it appeared that the unedited version from LRC replaced the edited iPad picture. Is that the case or is there some other step I'm missing?

And, once I download the pictures from the cloud into LRC as RAW photos, are the RAW photos deducted from the cloud to be replaced somehow?
Am I correct in thinking that the pictures once downloaded onto the desktop computer into LRC, can be further edited on the iPad and synced back to LRC via the cloud?

I did notice that when I exported the edited pic from the iPad, it's file size was 6MB - when I exported the same pic from LRC, it's file size was 12MB (I want to make this into a 16X20 print.)

Thanks!

 

[clee01l]

If I can take this a little further - While on a 2 week trip, I would load photos into LRM on my iPad Pro, which according to what I've read here, are automatically uploaded to the cloud, waiting for my return home to turn on the computer with LRC and download from those pictures from the cloud. That's what I did and as much as I can grasp now based on the responses in this thread.

My question(s) is/are: once the pictures are downloaded to the desktop LRC, what happens to the files remaining on the iPad when I try to work with them? Or, should I not work with them on the iPad? I noticed that when I did some edits on the iPad, those edits didn't seem to appear on the LRC version. Secondly, when I reopened the iPad to review the file I worked on, it appeared that the unedited version from LRC replaced the edited iPad picture. Is that the case or is there some other step I'm missing?

And, once I download the pictures from the cloud into LRC as RAW photos, are the RAW photos deducted from the cloud to be replaced somehow?
Am I correct in thinking that the pictures once downloaded onto the desktop computer into LRC, can be further edited on the iPad and synced back to LRC via the cloud?

I did notice that when I exported the edited pic from the iPad, it's file size was 6MB - when I exported the same pic from LRC, it's file size was 12MB (I want to make this into a 16X20 print.)

Thanks!

The Adobe Cloud contains two separate pieces of information. First is the original File as imported fro Lightroom Mobile. A copy of this stays on the mobile device. Space requirements might cause this file to be deleted in time. But not until a primary copy of the file has been sync’d to the cloud. This primary copy is then sync’d to LrC on the Desktop. Any edit adjustments are treated as a separate piece of information that is also stored in the Adobe cloud as something like a XMP file. This separate piece of edit adjustment is used to modify the original file for display on the Mobile device, Lightroom for the Web and as imported into Lightroom Classic. If you make a change on Lightroom Mobile or Lightroom Classic, these instructions are used to modify the piece of information stored as adjustments and sync’d back to the cloud and sync’d everywhere that an instance is referenced (Lightroom Mobile , Lightroom Classic etc. In that way the Adobe cloud becomes the repository for all mobile devices and keeps any Lightroom Mobile instance up to date The sync process with Lightroom Classic depends upon what images are sync’d from the cloud to Classic and separately what images are initially sync’d to the cloud from Classic.

Images that are imported from Lightroom (mobile) to the cloud are full size original copies and maintained in the plan storage limits (20GB or 1TB). If these are sync’d to Lightroom Classic, the full size copy of the original is imported and stored with the Lightroom Classic catalog. If an original is first imported into Lightroom Classic and then sync’d to the cloud only a proxy (editable size) copy of the images is sent to the cloud for use by any mobile Lightroom apps running on mobile devices. This proxy file is not stored in your plan storage limits. There is no limit to the number of files stored in the cloud this way.

You ask if the RAW photos are deducted from the cloud. The answer is no not automatically. So, If you have the 20GB plan, it won’t take long to consume the whole storage. However if you sync the cloud to the Lightroom Classic catalog, then the full size originals are no longer needed in the cloud and you can free up your storage plan for more. In Lightroom Classic there is a special collection called “All Sync’d Photographs”. It contains a listing of every image in Lightroom Classic that is also in the Lightroom cloud and library. Remove the image for the “All Sync’d Photographs” special collection and the full size image is deleted from the cloud storage. If you later wish to access the image from a mobile device again, you can use the sync function in Lightroom Classic to place a smaller proxy image in the free storage area of the Adobe cloud.


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[dkinpgh1]

The Adobe Cloud contains two separate pieces of information. First is the original File as imported fro Lightroom Mobile. A copy of this stays on the mobile device. Space requirements might cause this file to be deleted in time. But not until a primary copy of the file has been sync’d to the cloud. This primary copy is then sync’d to LrC on the Desktop. Any edit adjustments are treated as a separate piece of information that is also stored in the Adobe cloud as something like a XMP file. This separate piece of edit adjustment is used to modify the original file for display on the Mobile device, Lightroom for the Web and as imported into Lightroom Classic. If you make a change on Lightroom Mobile or Lightroom Classic, these instructions are used to modify the piece of information stored as adjustments and sync’d back to the cloud and sync’d everywhere that an instance is referenced (Lightroom Mobile , Lightroom Classic etc. In that way the Adobe cloud becomes the repository for all mobile devices and keeps any Lightroom Mobile instance up to date The sync process with Lightroom Classic depends upon what images are sync’d from the cloud to Classic and separately what images are initially sync’d to the cloud from Classic.

Images that are imported from Lightroom (mobile) to the cloud are full size original copies and maintained in the plan storage limits (20GB or 1TB). If these are sync’d to Lightroom Classic, the full size copy of the original is imported and stored with the Lightroom Classic catalog. If an original is first imported into Lightroom Classic and then sync’d to the cloud only a proxy (editable size) copy of the images is sent to the cloud for use by any mobile Lightroom apps running on mobile devices. This proxy file is not stored in your plan storage limits. There is no limit to the number of files stored in the cloud this way.

You ask if the RAW photos are deducted from the cloud. The answer is no not automatically. So, If you have the 20GB plan, it won’t take long to consume the whole storage. However if you sync the cloud to the Lightroom Classic catalog, then the full size originals are no longer needed in the cloud and you can free up your storage plan for more. In Lightroom Classic there is a special collection called “All Sync’d Photographs”. It contains a listing of every image in Lightroom Classic that is also in the Lightroom cloud and library. Remove the image for the “All Sync’d Photographs” special collection and the full size image is deleted from the cloud storage. If you later wish to access the image from a mobile device again, you can use the sync function in Lightroom Classic to place a smaller proxy image in the free storage area of the Adobe cloud.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I really appreciate the quick and thorough response, Cletus. But, just to make sure I understand, any edits I make on my iPad, after the files have been uploaded (and downloaded to LRC) will show up on the cloud, LRC and then returned to LRM when the file is reopened - is that correct? I would just have to be patient while that happens? Should LRC on the desktop kept open while the files that were initially loaded into LRM and then are edited on the iPad after they've been synced from the cloud?

 

[clee01l]

I really appreciate the quick and thorough response, Cletus. But, just to make sure I understand, any edits I make on my iPad, after the files have been uploaded (and downloaded to LRC) will show up on the cloud, LRC and then returned to LRM when the file is reopened - is that correct? I would just have to be patient while that happens? Should LRC on the desktop kept open while the files that were initially loaded into LRM and then are edited on the iPad after they've been synced from the cloud?

Yes once sync’d edit adjustment can be made anywhere and show up everywhere.

I leave my desktop running 7X24 with Lightroom Classic ope to receive any files or edits that get sent to the cloud. That way my LrC catalog is always up-to date. You don’t have to keep LrC ope but I find it convenient to do so an my Lightroom imported images are always available in LrC by the time I get home.


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