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What Am I Missing??

Joined
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I am not convinced that Adobe will remain committed to development of the desktop product. My concern is that as soon as they figure out how to get all the power and functionality into the cloud version, they'll begin to sunset the desktop version. Why not? They can sell the subscription with a basic amount of storage which will never be enough for even a hobbiest, and then sell the "upgrades" to cloud storage. Two sales for each user each year!
There's a variable that tends to get missed here... they're dependent on what people will buy. Whatever the marketing guys would like to sell, they're still dependent on what people want to buy. I suspect that will one day be entirely cloud-based, but they're building for the future. At the moment, most people don't have fast enough internet to make that viable, even if they wanted to. So I can't speak to someday, but I'm not seeing any signs of sunset for the foreseeable.
 
Joined
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Why not? They can sell the subscription with a basic amount of storage which will never be enough for even a hobbiest, and then sell the "upgrades" to cloud storage.
Moving every subscriber to the "cloudy" version (I like how that has been introduced for distinction) is going to require an enormous cloud storage on Adobe's part. There are two distinct types user. One a casual mobile user and another a professional or semi professional that uses the mobile cloud to augment their regular workflow. I think Adobe will buy and manage just enough cloud storage to effectively compete with Apple for the casual user and perhaps a little more of the pro-sumer that needs some cloud storage but not cloud storage for everything. If Adobe scales up to move everything to the cloud, I think they will fail. First, I don't thing Adobe can scale up to store everything for everybody without other people's data usage interfering with other customer's Second, I don't think the data risk of losing some client's once in a lifetime wedding photos to the cloud could be tolerated without a high risk of Adobe being sued by some professional wedding photographer AND the wedding party.
I think there will always be a locally based app to manage photos
 
Joined
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I agree. I think there are probably professional photographers who are not even legally allowed to store photos in the Adobe cloud, for privacy reasons. Think about medical photographers, for example, or forensic photographers.
 

PhilBurton

Lightroom enthusiast (but still learning)
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There's a variable that tends to get missed here... they're dependent on what people will buy. Whatever the marketing guys would like to sell, they're still dependent on what people want to buy. I suspect that will one day be entirely cloud-based, but they're building for the future. At the moment, most people don't have fast enough internet to make that viable, even if they wanted to. So I can't speak to someday, but I'm not seeing any signs of sunset for the foreseeable.
There are actually two issues here.
1. Merge the code base for Classic and cloud products, for engineering productivity. (It's really crazy to have two separate sets of software.)
2. Pricing plans and product configuration options so that people can still use the merged product primarily as a desktop tool. Alternatively, people will be forced to store all photos in the cloud.

For the first option, assuming that the products maintain their separate identities, the only way we users will notice this result is the cloud product will get a lot of the features it's now missing.

For the second option, Adobe must drastically lower the cost per TB of cloud storage, to be competitive with "free" services. Beyond that, if they offer only a cloud-based product, in effect they are "firing their customers." No rational company does absent a very good reason.

Phil Burton
 
Joined
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First, and most important is naming of the apps. "CC" no longer exists in the names of most of the Adobe apps, so the longer some of us continue to use old names the more difficult it will be communicating with the user population in general. So, going forward I'll use the current names, which are as follows:

a) Lightroom Classic (easier to just use Classic) is the current name of the traditional desktop-based app that has been in existence for over 10 years, i.e. the app you currently use.

b) Lightroom is now the general name for the family of apps which comprise the cloud ecosystem, formerly known as Lightroom CC. There are several variants, platform dependent, so.....
i) Lightroom Desktop (LrD for short, runs on MacOS or Windows systems)
ii) Lightroom Mobile (LrM for short, runs on mobile devices such as phones and tablets, may be sub-categorised as LrM for iOS or Android if relevant)
iii) Lightroom Web (LrWeb, runs in most browsers)
iv) Lightroom Apple TV
I hope that in the next round of name changes Adobe adopt the term "Cloudy version" as coined by Cletus ;)
 
Joined
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Hi, Folks,
Just getting back to this idea. I re-read through all your great tutorials, etc., but I'm still very timid to start and have lots more questions. I hope you're still willing to help, but if not, I'll understand that this is a long list of questions! o_O

Jim Wilde said I could use the "All Synced Photographs" collection in the Catalog panel to tell Classic what smart previews to sync to the cloud. Collections are something in Classic I use infrequently, so I am not sure what I can and can't do to efficiently get the photos I want synced into that folder.

If I have a whole (quite large) folder I would like sync'd like this. What is the best way to get those photos into that collection? I tried right-clicking so I could set it as my target collection so I could add the photos in that folder to the target collection, but there's no right-click menu on that collection. Can I drag the folder itself to that collection, or highlight all the photos in my folder and drag them to the collection?

Once I move photos into that collection, do I then need to turn on Sync with Lightroom from the top/left? That option seems to either be "on" or "paused," so I assume there's no "off" and it syncs anything in that folder automatically unless it is paused?

Can I assume that, however I get the photos into that folder, that they are only there 'virtually' and not in reality, and that they and their folder remain in their original location both in Classic and on my PC?

Must any photos I have in that "All Synced Photographs" collection remain in that collection and, thus, if I remove a photo from the collection does it get removed from the cloud?

If I create regular collection(s) and use the right-click > Sync with Lightroom option instead, is that still dependent on having the Sync with Lightroom (upper left of screen) un-paused?

Which method is better (the All Synced Photos or regular collections) in terms of organizing the photos once they're in the cloud?

Do I need Lightroom installed on my Android phone in order to see those synced photos from my phone?

Exactly where do I go (URL?) to see my photos that are in the cloud?
 
Joined
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If I have a whole (quite large) folder I would like sync'd like this. What is the best way to get those photos into that collection? I tried right-clicking so I could set it as my target collection so I could add the photos in that folder to the target collection, but there's no right-click menu on that collection. Can I drag the folder itself to that collection, or highlight all the photos in my folder and drag them to the collection?
If you have already created a collection then just drag those photos into it. If you have not yet created a collection then select the photos > Library > New Collection.

Once I move photos into that collection, do I then need to turn on Sync with Lightroom from the top/left? That option seems to either be "on" or "paused," so I assume there's no "off" and it syncs anything in that folder automatically unless it is paused?
Yes otherwise the photos will not sync. I only pause when editing.

Can I assume that, however I get the photos into that folder, that they are only there 'virtually' and not in reality, and that they and their folder remain in their original location both in Classic and on my PC?
Yes they are only virtual. If you delete the collection the actual photos will not be touched.

Must any photos I have in that "All Synced Photographs" collection remain in that collection and, thus, if I remove a photo from the collection does it get removed from the cloud?
If a photo is synced it will be in "all synced photos". You can un-sync photos from "All synced Photos" and they will disappear from "All synced photos" but remain in your collection.

If I create regular collection(s) and use the right-click > Sync with Lightroom option instead, is that still dependent on having the Sync with Lightroom (upper left of screen) un-paused?
Yes if its paused they will not sync.

Which method is better (the All Synced Photos or regular collections) in terms of organizing the photos once they're in the cloud?
It seems to me (others will put me right if I'm wrong) that the "All Synced Photos" is just an inbuilt smart collection that identifies all photos that are synced with the cloud. You cannot manage photos from there, except you can un-sync photos as stated above.

Do I need Lightroom installed on my Android phone in order to see those synced photos from my phone?
Yes... but you could possibly view them from the browser and log into your account on the Adobe site.

Exactly where do I go (URL?) to see my photos that are in the cloud?
Photo Editor | Online Photoshop Lightroom
 
Joined
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I just wanted to thank you all for your patience and excellent help! I now have successfully synced smart previews of specific photo groups from Classic on my PC to the cloud. I did this by creating collections in Classic for each related group of photos, turned on sync for each collection and for the main sync switch at the top-left in my Classic window. It worked perfectly and did not count against my 20GB I'm allocated via my Photography Plan subscription. I can now view these photos from my phone (or any other device or PC) by logging into https://lightroom.adobe.com.

In case it's helpful to anyone else playing around with this, here is what I confirmed to be the behavior of the collections I created for syncing, the default collection that Classic creates (All Synced Photos) in the Catalog panel when I sync, and the photos, once synced:
  • Once I create a COLLECTION and turn on syncing for it, the photos will sync to the cloud (assuming the main Sync switch is also turned on).
  • After everything syncs, if I ADD MORE PHOTOS TO A SYNCED COLLECTION, those new photos will sync as they are added (again, assuming both the collection sync and the main sync switches are turned on).
  • If I TURN OFF SYNCING for one of the synced collections I previously created, the photos already synced from that collection remain in the cloud and remain in the All Synced Photos collection in the Catalog panel in Lightroom Classic, but any subsequent photos I put in that collection will not be synced unless and until I turn syncing back on for that collection. However, on the lightroom.adobe.com site, the collection name is no longer displayed in the "Albums" list, and the photo(s) appear only in the "All Photos" list.
  • If I DELETE A SYNCED COLLECTION that I created, Classic gives me the option to leave the photos in All Synced Photos or not (therefore leaving them in the cloud or not).
  • If I delete a COLLECTION SET with synced collections below it, Classic currently does NOT warn you that you are deleting synced collections and, therefore does NOT give you the option to leave the photos in All Synced Photos. The photos in the collections inside the set will be removed from the cloud.
  • If I DELETE A PHOTO from All Synced Photos in Lightroom Classic, this will completely remove it from the cloud.
  • COLLECTION SET hierarchy does NOT sync. For example, if I create a hierarchy in Classic like this: Family Photos > Dad, the set name of "Family Photos" does not sync. Only the "Dad" collection syncs as an Album. You can create Album hierarchies once on the adobe site, but I did not find a way to sync hierarchies created within Classic Collection Sets.
  • Within the adobe site, there is limited EDITING CAPABILITIES (Basic sliders, but no Adjustment Brush, Radial/Graduated Filters, Spot Removal, etc.).
 
Joined
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  • Within the adobe site, there is limited EDITING CAPABILITIES (Basic sliders, but no Adjustment Brush, Radial/Graduated Filters, Spot Removal, etc.).
Which is why it makes more sense (to me at least) to install the relevant cloud client app on mobile devices (or even another desktop)....the editing capabilities of the Lightroom client apps are far more comparable to those in LR Classic. The Lightroom Web app is great for sharing albums (and adding Title and Caption metadata), but less useful for editing.
 
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Which is why it makes more sense (to me at least) to install the relevant cloud client app on mobile devices (or even another desktop)....the editing capabilities of the Lightroom client apps are far more comparable to those in LR Classic. The Lightroom Web app is great for sharing albums (and adding Title and Caption metadata), but less useful for editing.
Agree. If you are viewing on your phone then its much better to use the "Adobe Photoshop Lightroom" app. I have only ever used the Web site when my access was limited to a 3rd party computer.
 

PhilBurton

Lightroom enthusiast (but still learning)
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A couple of things you need to understand about use of the cloud ecosystem, which should partly answer your questions:

First, and most important is naming of the apps. "CC" no longer exists in the names of most of the Adobe apps, so the longer some of us continue to use old names the more difficult it will be communicating with the user population in general. So, going forward I'll use the current names, which are as follows:

a) Lightroom Classic (easier to just use Classic) is the current name of the traditional desktop-based app that has been in existence for over 10 years, i.e. the app you currently use.

b) Lightroom is now the general name for the family of apps which comprise the cloud ecosystem, formerly known as Lightroom CC. There are several variants, platform dependent, so.....
i) Lightroom Desktop (LrD for short, runs on MacOS or Windows systems)
ii) Lightroom Mobile (LrM for short, runs on mobile devices such as phones and tablets, may be sub-categorised as LrM for iOS or Android if relevant)
iii) Lightroom Web (LrWeb, runs in most browsers)
iv) Lightroom Apple TV

So, back to the important stuff:

1. Any image added/imported into the Lightroom apps, i.e. the cloud-based apps, is automatically synced to the cloud in full original format, and thus will automatically be available in preview form in any of the other Lightroom apps. Note, however, that the user can control whether that original file is also downloaded to those other apps/devices, though some functions (such as editing) will require the original to be downloaded. Also, because these are original format files, they all count against the user's cloud storage allowance

If Classic has also been sync-enabled, those images added to the cloud from any of the Lightroom apps will also automatically download in the same original format into the Classic catalog. The user can control where those originals are stored, via the Preferences>Lightroom Sync tab.

2. In Classic, nothing gets synced to the cloud unless/until the user decides to do that. It can be done either by adding images to a collection and then enabling that collection to be synced (so all images in that collection are synced), or by adding images to the special All Synced Photographs collection in the Catalog panel (which should match the total of All Photos in any of the Lightroom cloud apps). NOTE: images synced from Classic ONLY upload in Smart Preview format, not original, and they do NOT currently count against the user's cloud storage allowance. Thus it is possible to upload every image in the Classic catalog to the cloud, thus having them available on all mobile devices or in any browser window, at no cost to the user.

3. Deletions.....this bit needs to be understood carefully. If a file is deleted from ANY of the Lightroom cloud apps, it is deleted from the cloud and thus also deleted from any of the other Lightroom cloud apps. However, it is NOT deleted from Classic, though it will (logically) be "unsynced", meaning that it will be removed from the All Synced Photographs special collection AND from any synced collection(s) that it may have been in.

NOTE: If you delete/remove a synced file from the Classic catalog, it will be deleted from the cloud as well, thus it will also be removed from the Lightroom cloud apps.

So, with the above in mind, to get Smart Previews into the cloud, you sync from Classic. To get phone images into the cloud and thus into Classic you need to install the Lightroom Mobile app on the phone, then set it up to automatically add new phone captures into the app, and thus into the cloud and then down into Classic (having sync-enabled the Classic catalog). The mobile app has various settings which can be used, though the easiest method is simply to use the LrMobile app's own camera function as any such captures are automatically added to the app and thus synced to the cloud.

And no, it is not necessary to install the LrDesktop app on your Classic system, though it can be useful sometimes.
A late reply, upon re-reading Jim's excellent post. As if the rules regarding deletions aren't complicated enough, I often (but not always) copy over photos from my wife's phone. I have my way handing photos, and my wife has her way. Imagine if I decided that I didn't want to keep one of my wife's photos that was synced from her phone to Classic, only then I decided to delete that photo. Imagine that my wife liked that photo and wanted to keep it on her phone, only it just disappeared without warning. Uh-oh.

My stupid-simple way of copying photos from the DCIM folders in iPhones/iPads maintains peace at home.
 
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