Catalogs Upgrading PC Platform—Sanity Check Please – Part Two

[mjmuk]

Lightroom Version

What ever the latest is from my Adobe susbcription that I will re-download/re-install

Operating System

1. Windows 10

Hi,

It seems that time has passed by quickly since I wrote my previous post in January 2022 about rebuilding my PC and rejigging the discs. Well that is now all done; in the end I opted for a 1 TB SSD which is now happily running Windows 10 and all the various programs including a move from Office 2010 to Office 365!!

The only Programs/Apps left to install are the Adobe LR/PS ones, all my data is now happily back on the 'old' reformatted 2 TB SATA disc. I have re-read the MOVING TO A NEW COMPUTER PDF a couple of times, but still have a question.

All my images and the associated LR Catalogue info is safely on the 2 TB SATA Drive. One of the suggestions in the previous thread was to have the LR catalogue on the C: drive for faster performance, leaving all the images on the D: drive, I understand the reasons for this, but here is the Chicken/Egg question…

When I install LR on the C: drive, it will create a new catalogue as part of the installation. Once the installation is complete, and before I open LR; do I then copy/move the 'old/current' Catalogue from the D: drive to overwrite the new one that was installed on the C: drive when I installed LR.?

If I then open LR, I suspect I will need to change a few locations to sync everything up; or will I?

Sorry if I am missing something here, any pointers/suggestion/guidance clearly most welcome.

Thanks in advance.

 

[Replytoken]

If you are doing a "fresh" installation of LR Classic and Creative Cloud then when you open LR Classic it will create a new catalog. No worries, it can be deleted later. What you want to do is copy or move (copy is safer if you are unsure of what you are doing) the catalog files from your other drive to where you want them to reside on your C: drive. Then you have two choices, you can either open the catalog file in its new location and it will cause LR Classic to open and read the file. Or, you can open LR Classic, and direct it to the new location of the catalog and open it. Both will work. Just be careful if you copy your catalogs that you do not open the old versions by mistake. If all is successful, you can move/label them and keep them as backups.

Also, make sure you tell LR Classic where you want to store your backup files that it creates.

Good luck,

--Ken

 

[mjmuk]

Hi Ken,

Sorry to say that this did not work.

I downloaded LR and then choose a directory on the C: drive for the catalog location, then copied over my last 'saved' catalog from the D: drive.

Then clicked on the catalog once it was on the c: drive, which opened LR as you mentioned. However, while I could see all the directories correctly from the catalog info point of view, I could not see any of the images from the D: drive.

I had a look through the various LR options, but could not locate any indication as to how to tell LR where all the images were located!! Maybe I am being a bit thick about this part.

Anyway, rather than spending too much time on this, I decided to go back to having the catalog on the D: drive in the normal place. Once that was done and when I clicked on the catalog, up popped LR with all the catalog info correct along with all the images showing.

There is still a bit of customisation to be redone with regards my 'views' set-up, but all seems to be working okay and in fact the performance seems okay – probably because it's all on a newly reformatted disc. Will see over time if I need to move the D: drive from a SATA drive to another SSD.

But for the time being, all seems good.

Many thanks
Mike

 

[Replytoken]

Without seeing where the moved catalog thought the files were located, it would be difficult to say what happened, but I am glad things are working for you. I think that you might notice a bump in performance with an SSD if/when you upgrade, mostly related to the catalog being on it.

--Ken

 

[GregJ]

I have built 3 PCs since I started using LR and I always dread what you just went through because I always have trouble. Then I come here to get rescued.
I think when you get all sorted out, you should make sure to have your Adobe programs running on the 1TB boot drive and your cat there too. Your images will be stored on your old 2 TB SATA disk, and you will of course link LR to those files on that disk (which I always screw up).

Anyway, why don't you do this. Spend 200 bucks and buy a M.2 PCIe 4 SSD and mount it internally as your main data drive. You will not regret that.

Then back up your data disk to the 2 TB SATA SSD that you already have and also to a couple of external spinning hard disks (cheap). That gives you three backups and keep one off-site. (Note: I love GoodSync for this because it basically creates an exact clone of your data files and syncs any edits toi any file when you tell it to. The backup disks then have the same structure and file/folder names as the main base disk. You don't even have to restore if you lose your main base disk. Just use a backup like the original disk and reconnect the cat to it if you ever need to Fantastic capability.

I'm about to build a new PC probably in November when the 13th gen Intel Raptor Lake top-end PC chip hits with new 700 series Motherboards and DDR5, PCIe 5 and all of that great new connectivity. Plus, the new GeForce RTX 40 "Ada Lovelace" graphics cards will be out. I will build and then do what you are doing and I will screw up that sync of the LR cat to the new SSD data disk, which will be an 8TB M.2 NVMe PCIe 4 SSD that has all my images. The sync of that disk to the LR cat will be screwed up for sure. No doubt. Always is. But I will fix it after begging for help here when I screw it up.

Oh, and back up the LR catalog to the old 2 TB SATA SSD that you have (after buying the new one), and also to an external HDD.

 

[Replytoken]

I have built 3 PCs since I started using LR and I always dread what you just went through because I always have trouble. Then I come here to get rescued.
I think when you get all sorted out, you should make sure to have your Adobe programs running on the 1TB boot drive and your cat there too. Your images will be stored on your old 2 TB SATA disk, and you will of course link LR to those files on that disk (which I always screw up).

Anyway, why don't you do this. Spend 200 bucks and buy a M.2 PCIe 4 SSD and mount it internally as your main data drive. You will not regret that.

Then back up your data disk to the 2 TB SATA SSD that you already have and also to a couple of external spinning hard disks (cheap). That gives you three backups and keep one off-site. (Note: I love GoodSync for this because it basically creates an exact clone of your data files and syncs any edits toi any file when you tell it to. The backup disks then have the same structure and file/folder names as the main base disk. You don't even have to restore if you lose your main base disk. Just use a backup like the original disk and reconnect the cat to it if you ever need to Fantastic capability.

I'm about to build a new PC probably in November when the 13th gen Intel Raptor Lake top-end PC chip hits with new 700 series Motherboards and DDR5, PCIe 5 and all of that great new connectivity. Plus, the new GeForce RTX 40 "Ada Lovelace" graphics cards will be out. I will build and then do what you are doing and I will screw up that sync of the LR cat to the new SSD data disk, which will be an 8TB M.2 NVMe PCIe 4 SSD that has all my images. The sync of that disk to the LR cat will be screwed up for sure. No doubt. Always is. But I will fix it after begging for help here when I screw it up.

Oh, and back up the LR catalog to the old 2 TB SATA SSD that you have (after buying the new one), and also to an external HDD.

I appreciate the desire for better performance, but please take note that the OP stated that he was done with his rebuilding, and more importantly, was having trouble when he moved his catalog from an external drive to his primary internal drive. He is currently up and running with the catalog back on the external drive, and I do believe that solving the issues of relocating the catalog need to be addressed first, if at all, before recommending that he install new drives in his new machine. New hardware does not help a user when they are having trouble with mastering their software or resolving software-related issues.

--Ken

 

[GregJ]

Noted. But no one is ever finished rebuilding who builds! LOL. But yes, you are correct, he is fine. But don't think he is unaware of hardware. That dude just built a PC. Besides ... new hardware always helps everything. 100% of the time. That's like saying a new camera doesn't help your photography! LOL. (Now that is a topic for the ages and causes riots on the camera boards.)

 

[Victoria Bampton]

(Now that is a topic for the ages and causes riots on the camera boards.)

Yeah and we don't do rioting here! Friendly and positive!

 

[GregJ]

Haha. Yes, this really is a friendly positive place, and a wonderful Board for sure. The Gurus make it so.

The Gurus can get a bit snippy over certain things at certain times and in certain ways (we Old Men can get set in our opinions), but don't be too hard on them (I say with a tongue sticking in my cheek). They are darn good. I like all of them. I'm starting to think 75% of their answers could be just to point at a spot in your book ... like just say, "See Victorias book on page 612".
I think a little equipment and photography discussion from time to time is useful and applicable to the question. You have to have a computer to run LR and sometimes old machines cause new problems. And you have to have a camera and shoot raw to really use LR to any degree at all, so it kind of mixes in.

 

[Victoria Bampton]

I think a little equipment and photography discussion from time to time is useful and applicable to the question. You have to have a computer to run LR and sometimes old machines cause new problems.

Absolutely. We tend to keep those conversations to the Lounge unless they're in response to a specific question, that way those who aren't interested (or who would drool over new gear and can't afford it) can easily skip over it.

 

[PhilBurton]

I appreciate the desire for better performance, but please take note that the OP stated that he was done with his rebuilding, and more importantly, was having trouble when he moved his catalog from an external drive to his primary internal drive. He is currently up and running with the catalog back on the external drive, and I do believe that solving the issues of relocating the catalog need to be addressed first, if at all, before recommending that he install new drives in his new machine. New hardware does not help a user when they are having trouble with mastering their software or resolving software-related issues.

--Ken

+1 to @Replytoken here.

Nor did the OP indicate that he would benefit by installing a PCIE-4 NMVe drive as opposed to a less expensive PCIE-3 drive.

 

[GregJ]

+1 to @Replytoken here.

Nor did the OP indicate that he would benefit by installing a PCIE-4 NMVe drive as opposed to a less expensive PCIE-3 drive.

He would have to have a newer motherboard, CPU and chipset to make use PCIe 4. But yes, I would recommend that for anyone from this point forward. Of course. That is an obvious given. That is of course for anyone buying any system or building from this point forward.
But if you wait 3 months I'm going to be saying the same thing about PCIe Gen 5. But 4 will do for a good while. 3? No. Not anymore.

 

[BobT]

Hi,

All my images and the associated LR Catalogue info is safely on the 2 TB SATA Drive. One of the suggestions in the previous thread was to have the LR catalogue on the C: drive for faster performance, leaving all the images on the D: drive, I understand the reasons for this, but here is the Chicken/Egg question…

I've done the same. I know the catalogue should be on the C: drive for speed as you say, but it's data so logic has it that it should be with data on D:. It just makes things simpler when backing up. The C: drive is a 1TB NVMe attached to the CPU. The D: drive is also a 1TB NVMe but attached to the chipset. I can tell you, it all runs blisteringly fast. It's truly amazing how relatively cheap NVMes are and so easy to install but you need a motherboard that takes them. I also have a couple of legacy spinning HDD that are used for night-time backups only.

 

[GregJ]

Good job. If you are talking internal NVMe PCIe M.2 SSDs, which I suppose you are, you are probably at PCIe Gen 3 which is the current sweet-spot and most systems from the past few years will take that drive on the MoBo. PCIe Gen 4 is getting more common on systems purchased or built in the last year and they feel blistering fast in the right environment. PCIe 5 SSDs are coming out now, but there is no need to buy one unless the CPU, chipset, MB and everything else can utilize it (although it is backwards compatible).

For example, I build in October, and that rig is going to boot off of a 2 TB PCIe Gen 5 SSD, but I will be building with all of the latest components that will allow for and support PCIe Gen 5. It will be a while before PCIe 5 is common. Top-end laptops and desktops will have it next year.
But even if the SSD is a basic old cheap SATA SSD, the feel moving from a spinning HDD is a huge leap in capability. That plain old SATA SSD is 4 times faster than a spinning HDD but feels 20 times faster (because of latency). PCIe 3 SSDs are 4 times faster than SATA SSDs. Then PCIe 4 (which is getting common now) is twice as fast as PCIe 3. PCIe 5 SSDs will be twice as fast as PCIe 4 SSDs.
Is LR gearing up for this? Yes. I bet you my new PC that they are. In fact, I know they are.

 

[PhilBurton]

... ...

Then PCIe 4 (which is getting common now) is twice as fast as PCIe 3. PCIe 5 SSDs will be twice as fast as PCIe 4 SSDs.
Is LR gearing up for this? Yes. I bet you my new PC that they are. In fact, I know they are.

GregJ,

As a sanity check, I looked up "Adobe" on LinkedIn. I found 32, 000 results, which is more than the entire current Adobe population.

So on those 32,000 results, I did a search for GPU. I got about a dozen hits. Then I did a search for "driver." I got about another dozen hits. Some of these people drive/drove for Uber. One or two were "revenue drivers" for Adobe. Exactly none of them were device driver developers.

So help me understand how you know that LR is gearing up for these faster CPIE-5 PCs?

Of course, several years from now Adobe might revise the specifications for a "baseline" system to include use of an SSD for program files and catalogs, because Apple and Microsoft will no longer upgrade the OS of machines that don't use an SSD and Adobe limits support for older OS.

 

[GregJ]

GregJ,

As a sanity check, I looked up "Adobe" on LinkedIn. I found 32, 000 results, which is more than the entire current Adobe population.

So on those 32,000 results, I did a search for GPU. I got about a dozen hits. Then I did a search for "driver." I got about another dozen hits. Some of these people drive/drove for Uber. One or two were "revenue drivers" for Adobe. Exactly none of them were device driver developers.

So help me understand how you know that LR is gearing up for these faster CPIE-5 PCs?

Of course, several years from now Adobe might revise the specifications for a "baseline" system to include use of an SSD for program files and catalogs, because Apple and Microsoft will no longer upgrade the OS of machines that don't use an SSD and Adobe limits support for older OS.

Phil, you say you did a sanity check, but I'm not so sure....
Like Victoria said a few times, Adobe is placing a high priority on making LR faster and more efficient. It just went through a large rewrite in order to utilize the GPU for what was previously a CPU intensive task - exporting jpegs. Victoria speculated that they were no doubt now working on incorporating the GPU for another big CPU-intensive task - building 1:1 preview files. But she said that ain't easy and I'm sure revamping old code is not.

What I'm saying is that I bet Adobe is also working on better utilization of reading raw files off of an SSD, whether it be an internal or external SATA or on a PCIe lane, because right now the Gurus confirm that loading that raw file in the development module is no faster off an SSD than it is off of an HDD. That is an area that is ripe for improvement, right? (I documented above the speed differences between an HDD and the various levels of SSDs).

You keep talking about a baseline system and that Adobe is writing for that. What do you think a baseline system is? I think a baseline system today incorporates a PCIe Gen 3 SSD drive, not a spinning HDD. I say that from experience and that is basically what all the computer publications are saying now. Furthermore, LR is a program for raw shooters. Raw shooters are not the masses. Phone shooters are the masses. For example, Adobe was slow with incorporating the use of GPUs, even though their PS and LR" base" has been using them for years and are far more likely to be computer savvy than your average non-PS-LR user.

Hey, it is not that big a deal. LR is plenty fast for me right now.

 

[Replytoken]

Is LR gearing up for this? Yes. I bet you my new PC that they are. In fact, I know they are.

What I'm saying is that I bet Adobe is also working on better utilization of reading raw files off of an SSD

I suspect that @PhilBurton wrote in reply to the first statement I have copied above. For the sake of clarity, we tend to try and stick to the literal meaning of "I know" in the forum, where what is known can be supported with verifiable facts. "I know" based on "I believe" or "I bet" can get confusing since it is not based on fact, bur rather belief.

Over the years we have had some members of the trade or gurus who are affiliated with Adobe participate in the forum. When there were rumors swirling about, usually about a new release, it was often said that "those who know cannot say (due to NDA), and those who say do not know". It's fine to speculate about what we would like Adobe to do, and all of us here do, but there would be less confusion if we were clear about what we would like vs. what is actually known. We have a lot of members who are very new to the LR ecosystem and clarity is important when we share information with them.

--Ken

 

[GregJ]

I see what you mean. I see your point about my claim of knowledge about what Adobe is really doing. You cherry-picked two of my quotes out of long posts, and I probably should not have said "know," so let me give you a third and better quote that you can use that clears it all up.

Let me amend all of that to say, "I bet you Adobe is working on making LR better and faster and that includes optimizing as best they can for the use of fast SSDs, more CPU cores of all types, fast USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 and TB4/USB4 ports, and the late generation of Nvidia and AMD GPUs. That is a safe statement, right? We can all agree on that notion. In fact, it is obvious that they are chipping away at this as the last version had a fair bit of that and it is obvious that they are moving forward and don't have blinders on.

The funny thing for me is, I really don't care because on my rig LR is already screaming fast. The only thing I notice is the slight bit of gulp when you first click a new raw into the Develop Module and it has to bring that file in from disk. Remember what started all this over several threads - the amazing reality that in the LR Dev Module, it reads those raw hits on a fast late gen SSD over a fast lane or port at the same speed as a spinning external HDD on a much slower port! That amazing realization is what started this whole discussion. Don't forget that important point. It is senseless to argue if Adobe is working on that because of course they are....

So, let's use an example. Let's take one of the fastest (if not the fastest) external SSD now on the market - the SanDisk Extreme Pro v2. It is probably the best professional-grade portable USB 20 Gbps SSD. It is USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 capable, so it can pass data at 20 Gbps over a rated USB-C cable and the SSD itself is a PCIe Gen 3 M.2 NVMe baby, so when paired with the latest systems that fully support its USB 20 Gbps connection (in other words, a system with a USB C 3.2 Gen 2X2 or TB4/USB4 port), it flies along at warp speed. And remember, that is just PCIe Gen 3! Not even 4 or 5. Those Gen 4 and 5 SSDs will be passing date externally at double that PCIe Gen 3 rate pretty soon, if not right now. But right now, that is 80 times faster than that an external spinning HDD. See what I mean?
I'm not sure I believe that LR really behaves that way right now when comparing the fastest SSDs (on a fast port) and slow HDD (on a slow port) in the Develop Module, but we already settled that argument. I had trouble believing that to begin with, but I accept it as fact now as 3 gurus and two more testers have said it (and I believe it).

 

[Replytoken]

I see what you mean. I see your point about my claim of knowledge about what Adobe is really doing. You cherry-picked two of my quotes out of long posts, and I probably should not have said "know," so let me give you a third and better quote that you can use that clears it all up.

Let me amend all of that to say, "I bet you Adobe is working on making LR better and faster and that includes optimizing as best they can for the use of fast SSDs, more CPU cores of all types, fast USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 and TB4/USB4 ports, and the late generation of Nvidia and AMD GPUs. That is a safe statement, right? We can all agree on that notion. In fact, it is obvious that they are chipping away at this as the last version had a fair bit of that and it is obvious that they are moving forward and don't have blinders on.

The funny thing for me is, I really don't care because on my rig LR is already screaming fast. The only thing I notice is the slight bit of gulp when you first click a new raw into the Develop Module and it has to bring that file in from disk. Remember what started all this over several threads - the amazing reality that in the LR Dev Module, it reads those raw hits on a fast late gen SSD over a fast lane or port at the same speed as a spinning external HDD on a much slower port! That amazing realization is what started this whole discussion. Don't forget that important point. It is senseless to argue if Adobe is working on that because of course they are....

So, let's use an example. Let's take one of the fastest (if not the fastest) external SSD now on the market - the SanDisk Extreme Pro v2. It is probably the best professional-grade portable USB 20 Gbps SSD. It is USB 3.2 Gen 2x2 capable, so it can pass data at 20 Gbps over a rated USB-C cable and the SSD itself is a PCIe Gen 3 M.2 NVMe baby, so when paired with the latest systems that fully support its USB 20 Gbps connection (in other words, a system with a USB C 3.2 Gen 2X2 or TB4/USB4 port), it flies along at warp speed. And remember, that is just PCIe Gen 3! Not even 4 or 5. Those Gen 4 and 5 SSDs will be passing date externally at double that PCIe Gen 3 rate pretty soon, if not right now. But right now, that is 80 times faster than that an external spinning HDD. See what I mean?
I'm not sure I believe that LR really behaves that way right now when comparing the fastest SSDs (on a fast port) and slow HDD (on a slow port) in the Develop Module, but we already settled that argument. I had trouble believing that to begin with, but I accept it as fact now as 3 gurus and two more testers have said it (and I believe it).

Yes, I do suspect that Adobe is doing all kinds of things to make the LR family of software work faster and better in some form or another, so I do not disagree with your statement about that. It was not my intention to cherry pick statements from your posts; but it was my intention to call attention to a statement that could easily be misinterpreted, and indeed was called out by somebody for clarification. As I mentioned above, the forum tends to a lot of beginners (although @PhilBurton is not one of them), and it would be best if we were clear about stating opinions vs. facts so they do not confuse the two. Thank you for understanding.

--Ken

 

[GregJ]

Ken, I agree. Your post was good and I was guilty of some exaggeration in terms of my knowledge of what Adobe is doing. I have zero contacts at Adobe. But I admire that company and am a big fan of LR and PS.

 

[PhilBurton]

Phil, you say you did a sanity check, but I'm not so sure....
Like Victoria said a few times, Adobe is placing a high priority on making LR faster and more efficient. It just went through a large rewrite in order to utilize the GPU for what was previously a CPU intensive task - exporting jpegs. Victoria speculated that they were no doubt now working on incorporating the GPU for another big CPU-intensive task - building 1:1 preview files. But she said that ain't easy and I'm sure revamping old code is not.

What I'm saying is that I bet Adobe is also working on better utilization of reading raw files off of an SSD, whether it be an internal or external SATA or on a PCIe lane, because right now the Gurus confirm that loading that raw file in the development module is no faster off an SSD than it is off of an HDD. That is an area that is ripe for improvement, right? (I documented above the speed differences between an HDD and the various levels of SSDs).

You keep talking about a baseline system and that Adobe is writing for that. What do you think a baseline system is? I think a baseline system today incorporates a PCIe Gen 3 SSD drive, not a spinning HDD. I say that from experience and that is basically what all the computer publications are saying now. Furthermore, LR is a program for raw shooters. Raw shooters are not the masses. Phone shooters are the masses. For example, Adobe was slow with incorporating the use of GPUs, even though their PS and LR" base" has been using them for years and are far more likely to be computer savvy than your average non-PS-LR user.

Hey, it is not that big a deal. LR is plenty fast for me right now.

To EVERYONE,

I thought long and hard before doing this post. I have been a member for a long time now, and I have benefited hugely from all the good advice and information that I have received in this forum, from many different people. This forum is my GO TO forum for Lightroom. Victoria's LR FAQ book is the best, in my opinion. Also I like that the fact that the information I have received in this forum has been very reliable and trustworthy.

Because of my particular professional background in high-tech in Silicon Valley, I feel that it is my obligation to "repay" all the efforts made by other people whose contributions have benefited me. My 40 years of career experience has been almost entirely in software and systems companies doing planning and marketing of software products. I have watched "the sausage being made" and I have been one of the "sausage makers."



So I feel impelled to respond here to the post I'm quoting.

It proves nothing to say, "I bet Adobe is also working on better utilization of reading raw files off of an SSD ..." Since Adobe does not provide roadmaps of future products (most companies do not, for several good reasons), the person making this statement has the burden of providing some proof. However, we have seen no proof of any sort. Absent any such proof, this statement has zero credibility.

Further, in previous posts, I suggested that the open source program GIMP, which is a Photoshop clone, could be examined to see if there is any code relating to "low level" drive performance per se. I also suggested that one could scan all the entries in Linkedin.com, to see how many Adobe employees work in low-level driver development. My own searches turned up no one. We have not seen any posts in response to these two suggestions that would indicate that Adobe employees are doing low-level driver development. (GPUs excepted, of course.) Again assertions that Adobe employees are working on low-level driver development have no credibility whatever in the absence of some form of documentation.

Ultimately, I'm doing this post because I would hate to see some people in this forum making expensive mistakes in purchasing hardware as a result of statements that I don't consider trustworthy or credible.

 

[PhilBurton]

You keep talking about a baseline system and that Adobe is writing for that. What do you think a baseline system is? I think a baseline system today incorporates a PCIe Gen 3 SSD drive, not a spinning HDD. I say that from experience and that is basically what all the computer publications are saying now. Furthermore, LR is a program for raw shooters. Raw shooters are not the masses. Phone shooters are the masses. For example, Adobe was slow with incorporating the use of GPUs, even though their PS and LR" base" has been using them for years and are far more likely to be computer savvy than your average non-PS-LR user.

The quoted statement indicates a complete lack of understanding of "market segmentation." Market segmentation is key to sorting out a large overall market into different categories, only some of which will have products developed for these segments. For more information, see https://www.imsmarketing.ie/business-strategy/the-importance-of-market-segmentation/

Market research in various forms is necessary to formulate market segments. In my career I have done market research and market segmentation any number of times. It is fundamentally wrong to assert that all RAW shooters are LrC customers and all phone shooters are "the masses." Following that approach, one could claim that all left-handed people are affluent and all right-handed people are not affluent. This last statement is absurd on its face.

The fact that LrC users mostly shoot RAW might be an outcome of market research, not a statement made without justification. Same for LR (cloudy) and phone users. As we know just from this forum, there are plenty of sophisticated users who use both programs in their workflow or prefer Cloudy. And we can also see by many posts that not all LrC users are not as sophisticated (at the time they did their posts).

 

[GregJ]

Phil,

You are getting too serious in your constant disagreements with me about everything. This is a discussion board about a software program called LightRoom and that program is used by most photographers as a way to best develop and organize their raw files. It has evolved to become a great program for other things too and I use it every day (and yes, I only shoot raw).

There is nothing wrong with talking about what we think Adobe is working on in making LR better, faster and more efficient in the future and I stand by my take on what they are working on. Look, I respect your past profession in the software industry, but do you work in Adobe now or have good contacts there?

If I'm wrong who cares? But two years from now, do you want the LR Develop Module to behave the same with an external HDD as it would with an internal NVMe PCIe 5 M.2 SSD that is 80 times faster and has vastly increased speed and feel on literally everything?

I hope not.

But seriously Phil, come on now.... Do you really think LR has not evolved over the years as a program to handle raw files? Are those raw files getting bigger or smaller? Are the computers that photographers use getting faster or slower? Is technology standing still? Is Adobe frozen in time? Does Adobe want to fall behind? No. Is Adobe PS and LR the absolute best tools for photographers to use in their work? Yes.

Will they stay that way?

 

[Victoria Bampton]

There is nothing wrong with talking about what we think Adobe is working on in making LR better, faster and more efficient in the future and I stand by my take on what they are working on.

Those with that level of information about what Adobe is or isn't working on are under NDA, so Phil is right, it's purely speculation and should be stated as such.

Statements can easily be taken as fact by others finding the thread, and that can be detrimental. An example... someone was very upset this week because they'd read on a forum elsewhere that Live Photos were fully supported by Lightroom, and so they felt they'd been lied to by Adobe. We have a duty to ensure the accuracy of the statements we post, as far as possible.

 

[GregJ]

Those with that level of information about what Adobe is or isn't working on are under NDA, so Phil is right, it's purely speculation and should be stated as such.

Statements can easily be taken as fact by others finding the thread, and that can be detrimental. An example... someone was very upset this week because they'd read on a forum elsewhere that Live Photos were fully supported by Lightroom, and so they felt they'd been lied to by Adobe. We have a duty to ensure the accuracy of the statements we post, as far as possible.

I agree completely. I know on any camera or software board you have to be careful what you say and how you say it because internet arguments with people you don't know can get out of whack, be misinterpreted, and be a bit stiff. Plus, no matter what board it is, there are always guys who have been there for years that bristle at anyone stating any opinion strongly. So, I have learned to dampen it a bit even though I have strong opinions about stuff I'm very interested in and know a lot about (photography, photography equipment, computers and LR).

For example, I've been a Fuji shooter since they came out with the XT-1 ages ago and probably had 15,000 posts on the DPR Fuji and Medium Format Boards over 12 years or so as we all pontificated and theorized about photography, post-processing raw files, camera gear and what Fuji is up to next. I've doled out a lot of advice and have owned and shot extensively almost every piece of Fuji gear there is. I've probably shot it more than any single human on Earth to be honest. I didn't say shot it well - just shot it a lot.

I've known several Fuji reps and think I know Fuji probably more than most people, but I don't go on the Boards and start saying that I know what they are going to do next. I just say what I think they should do next.

We do know this about Adobe. We know Adobe has said they want to make LR as fast and efficient as possible and that they are working on making LR faster and more powerful on computers that we know for a fact are much faster and far more powerful than they have ever been. We know what they did on the last few releases. We know that they have made a lot of strides in the past 3 years on making better use of more CPU cores and of the GPU because they were a bit slow out of the blocks on that tech. We can safely say they are working to make LR better and to make better use of new computer tech, since people who use LR are using it on a computer.

Anyway, I'm done discussing what I think LR is working on and should never have used the work "know" which I guess I tossed in carelessly on some post on some thread. Speculating on what Adobe will do next or is working on with the next release is a popular topic on any Adobe-related forum, and it certainly is a popular topic on any camera equipment or photography forum because so many photographers use LR in their post processing of raw files. I'm interested in it because I'm a photographer and my tools are cameras, along with LR. And I'm fascinated by any new camera and any new LR improvement.

Anyway, sorry if anyone thinks I meant that I have insider knowledge on Adobe because I don't know anyone there. I just have an opinion about what I think they are most likely working on and what I would like them to work on. I think someone should start a thread entitled "What do you think Adobe should work on to make LR even better and faster than it already is?" That would be a good thread because I bet Adobe would read it. I would say:

1. Make better use of both E and P Cores and threads for a wider range of tasks.
2. Make better use of highly capable and powerful GPUs for a wider range of tasks (like building previews and also work in the dev module).
3. Make better use of faster later-gen SSDs that are connected via TB4/USB 4 ports in the development module and everywhere a read to disk happens.
4. Make the syncing of cats between laptops and PCs better, easier and less prone to hiccup.
5. Make it to where I'm not terrified to do anything with LR and my raw files in the cloud.
6. Figure out a way to make a DNG file have a sidecar file and stop writing to the darn raw file itself. LOL. (I know that ain't just Adobe.)
7. Continue to be the best software in the world for photographers.