Tried to transfer XMP files, didn't work

[fishfry]

Imported a folder of images, made some edits and ratings. New to lightroom so still working on getting organized. Wanted to change the folder location. First did cmd-S (on Mac) to write xmp files. Then deleted the old import and re-imported, with the xmp files in place. They were not honored. Tried "Read Metadata" but that didn't work either. The xmp files are there and appear to have the right info in them. What did I do wrong?

 

[dj_paige]

First, the idea of deleting photos from Lightroom and reimporting is a very bad idea. A terrible idea. You lose information when you do this. And ... a waste of time.

When you want to move photos that are already in Lightroom, use the Lightroom Folder Panel. Move them in the Folder Panel. Drag and drop. Simple, no re-importing, and you don't lose information.

Next, I strongly advise you to stop thinking about organizing in terms of folder location. Lightroom gives you better tools to organize your photos — keywords, metadata, collection — than anything you can come up with using folders. So instead of moving photos from one folder to another folder for the purpose of getting organized, leave them right where they are, don't even worry about the folder name. Apply appropriate Lightroom keywords and metadata and add to Lightroom collections as desired. Then you can search for your photos using the very powerful search tools in LR, instead of the much less powerful searching via folders.

 

[Brad Snyder]

fishfry, welcome to the forums. If you can tell us a bit more about exact file locations, and moves, etc., perhaps we can steer you in the right direction. While Paige gives good advice, it's not exactly on point with your current problem.

 

[fishfry]

Hi. I have everything back to where it was before I started. FWIW I'm a longtime software engineer, so dealing with the filesystem is very natural to me. And I've been a photog for a long time and have a lot of photos under my existing system of file organization. It's not like I can just forget everything I know just because I bought a new program. And of course it's BECAUSE I have my filesystem organization so well under control and mapped into my head that I was easily able to restore the original images and LR catalog. Ok enough of that

Anyway ... the files are on disk in a folder named 2'1'-'1-23. The import into LR is under that, in DCIM/1''EOS5D as they came out of the Canon 5D. I have two problems with this:

1) Before importing, I forgot to run my normal import script (custom script, written by me) that would have moved the files into 2'1'-'1-23/takecr2.

There's also a file rename that the script does, but I can do the file rename in LR.

2) I imported by telling it to import "1''EOS5D" so that's what shows up in the LR folder panel. Needless to say this will not be helpful, since ALL my files are in a folder with that name. Instead, I realized from experimentation that if I import from the *top level* 2'1'-'1-23, it will still import the same images from the subfolder, but the folder panel will clearly show me the shoot date from all my shoots. That's what I want.

So I need to (1) move the files from 2'1'-'1-23/DCIM/1''EOS5D to 2'1'-'1-23/takecr2. (My script makes two subfolders, takecr2 and takejpg, to separate out cr2's from jpg's.) ...

... and (2) make the folder panel show the top level folder name 2'1'-'1-23, instead of "DCIM," which won't be helpful in the future.

In the worst case I can just blow away the catalog, re-import the original images, and re-do my edits. It's not a big deal. It's mostly the star ratings I was hoping to recover.

Thanks for any insight ...

 

[fishfry]

ps ...

a) Even if I can solve this problem from within LR, it still doesn't explain why writing XMPs, blowing away the import, and re-importing with XMPs didn't honor the existing edits; and ...

b) If I do a "rename folder" in the folder panel, it renames the folder ON DISK. That's not what I want, I only want to rename the folder as it appears in the folder panel.

 

[Mark Sirota]

[quote author=fishfry link=topic=9'23.msg6'778#msg6'778 date=12644463'7]
a) Even if I can solve this problem from within LR, it still doesn't explain why writing XMPs, blowing away the import, and re-importing with XMPs didn't honor the existing edits[/quote]

I can't explain that one either.

[quote author=fishfry link=topic=9'23.msg6'778#msg6'778 date=12644463'7]b) If I do a "rename folder" in the folder panel, it renames the folder ON DISK. That's not what I want, I only want to rename the folder as it appears in the folder panel.[/quote]

Then you misunderstand Lightroom's folders. They're just showing you the folders on disk. If you rename one, you have to rename the other.

If you want some other form of storage container, look at Collections, Collection Sets, and Smart Collections. (This is where Paige jumps in again.)

 

[Denis Pagé]

EDIT: Not Paige this time but Pagé

For a): Select the images and "read metadata from files" to incorporate the XMP in Lightroom.

For b): The folder panel is a direct view of your hard disk so it is tied to it. What is good of that is that you can rename/rearrange directly from Lightroom. Lightroom offer a solution to you to have different names from the hard disk and it is the "Collections" concept. To do that, select images from a folder, click the + near collections to add one and name it as you wish.

 

[dj_paige]

[quote author=fishfry link=topic=9'23.msg6'772#msg6'772 date=12644455'2]
Hi. I have everything back to where it was before I started. FWIW I'm a longtime software engineer, so dealing with the filesystem is very natural to me. And I've been a photog for a long time and have a lot of photos under my existing system of file organization. It's not like I can just forget everything I know just because I bought a new program. And of course it's BECAUSE I have my filesystem organization so well under control and mapped into my head that I was easily able to restore the original images and LR catalog. Ok enough of that
[/quote]

Sorry, can't agree. No matter how fastidious and organized your folders may be, using the search capabilities in Lightroom for keywords, metadata and collections give you much greater flexibility and power than anything you can do in folders. Folders must be hierarchical, and a photo can exist in one folder and in one location in the folder hierarchy. Lightroom allows photos to have multiple keywords and be in multiple collections; in other words, in Lightroom, you can place your photo into as many hierarchies as possible, even while the photo exists in a single folder. Thus, if you want to find all your photos of your daughter Jennifer, regardless of the folder, this is a very simple search in LR; it is nearly impossible to do in folders. If you want to find all of your photos of Jennifer at the beach, this is a very simple search in LR, but nearly impossible to do in folders.

 

[Brad Snyder]

[quote author=fishfry link=topic=9'23.msg6'778#msg6'778 date=12644463'7]
ps ...

a) Even if I can solve this problem from within LR, it still doesn't explain why writing XMPs, blowing away the import, and re-importing with XMPs didn't honor the existing edits; and ...

[/quote]

The files have to have matching names. e.g. a_file.cr2 alongside a_file.xmp With all the renaming going on, any chance that got out of synch?

 

[b_gossweiler]

[quote author=Denis Pagé link=topic=9'23.msg6'78'#msg6'78' date=1264446744]...
For a): Select the images and "read metadata from files" to incorporate the XMP in Lightroom.
...
[/quote]

My imports always pick up the information in XMP sidecars if present together with RAWs, no need to read metadata from files seperately afterwards.
[list type=decimal]
[li]As Brad mentioned, the XMPs have to have the correct name and reside in the same folder[/li]
[li]You might want to have a closer look at an XMP and see if the development settings have been written into there at all.[/li]
[li]If yes, it's a question of import, if no, it's a question of writing the XMPs.[/li]
[/list]
Beat

 

[fishfry]

Thanks to everyone who responded. I'm learning a lot from this. I got my folder rename done ... first I did "Update this folder location," to the new folder. LR complained that the images were missing but created the folder in the folder panel. Then I went to the filesystem and manually copied the files to the new folder. I restarted LR and all was well.

However, the folder still had the name of the lowest-level folder containing the images, which in my case is "takecr2." As I move more of my images over to LR, I want each shoot to be identified by date in my folder panel.

The solution was "Add Parent Folder." That caused the parent folder to display, and that's the folder name I want displayed. So I think I have this under control and can go forward importing everything else.

I haven't tried the XMP experiment again, but I agree with those who suggested that I probably got the filenames messed up as I was hacking away at all this.

Paige, of course I'm enthusiastic about keyword searching and all LR's other capabilities. I'm in the process of transferring ten years worth of digital photos to LR and my instinct is to go slowly and understand what I'm doing at every step of the way.

I'm in good company. Martin Evening's LR2 book, page 219. He's talking about how the modern trend is to organize computer files by metadata, with the underlying filesystem structure being of less importance to the user. "But when it comes to organizing and maintaining legacy folders that contain precious data, it's hardly surprising that photographers wish to know how to manage and access everything using tried and trusted methods."

That's all I'm saying.

Peace

 

[dj_paige]

[quote author=fishfry link=topic=9'23.msg6'793#msg6'793 date=1264461522]
Paige, of course I'm enthusiastic about keyword searching and all LR's other capabilities. I'm in the process of transferring ten years worth of digital photos to LR and my instinct is to go slowly and understand what I'm doing at every step of the way.

I'm in good company. Martin Evening's LR2 book, page 219. He's talking about how the modern trend is to organize computer files by metadata, with the underlying filesystem structure being of less importance to the user. "But when it comes to organizing and maintaining legacy folders that contain precious data, it's hardly surprising that photographers wish to know how to manage and access everything using tried and trusted methods."
[/quote]

This is one reason why Martin Evening's book is my favorite Lightroom book. If I could make a recommendation, it is to simply stop thinking of folders and file names. Use folders as storage locations, and that's it. Use Lightroom tools for organizing.

But as you say, go slowly and understand what you are doing. This is a good strategy.