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Sharpening Images

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gegjr

Active Member
Premium Classic Member
Premium Cloud Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2021
Messages
252
Location
Indianapolis, IN
Lightroom Experience
Advanced
Lightroom Version
Classic
Lightroom Version Number
Lightroom Classic version: 11.2
Operating System
  1. Windows 10
Can someone please point me to a good recent tutorial on Adobe.com for sharpening images in LrC 11.2? I keep finding older tutorials that don't take into account the latest updates. Thanks
 
Solution
Anyway, I can't even see how to get to Select Subject and Select Sky or any of the other adjustment tools you mention above in LrC. I only see the crop, spot removal, red eye correction and Masking (Shift+W) options. Are those others only in PS? I'm obviously confuse.
If I select a subject (a person) can I invert to select just the surrounding area?
Admittedly, it’s a little confusing that where to create a new mask changes depending on whether an image has existing masks or not; see the demo below.

Lightroom Classic 11 masks v00.gif


When a mask is selected, you can see an Invert check box, so you can invert a Select Subject to get its background.

For the rest of it, like the others are saying, it’s all explained in the current materials, including...
So you are saying you can’t find any tutorials that are more recent than version 6? If I type “how to sharpen in Lightroom Classic” in Google, I get 131,000 hits. If I limit the search to results not older than one year, I still get 129 hits. Here’s one from Adobe.com: https://helpx.adobe.com/lightroom-classic/how-to/sharpen-blurry-photo.html
Johan, I did see that. If you scroll to bottom of page did you notice the date is 2018? How many changes have there been to the develop module tools since 2018?
 

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The Adobe article is very basic, and doesn’t cover some of the key strategies for sharpening with Lightroom. Google found a great PDF article by Martin Evening, which discusses in detail some of the most important concepts: How to set the Sharpening options, how to mitigate side effects of sharpening by using (and visualizing) the Masking option, and how to think about the Noise Reduction options. It’s about Adobe Camera Raw, but the same control set is used in Lightroom.
Camera Raw Sharpening and Noise Reduction

Now, because of the concerns about outdated tutorials, it would be worth bringing up that the article is 12 years old. Is that a big deal? No. If you look at the screen shots, the Sharpening panel is identical to what is in the current version of Lightroom. The only visible difference is a new-ish Smoothness option in the Noise Reduction section. That option helps with high ISO images that have visible low-frequency color noise; that is, big splotches instead of tiny speckles. But that’s pretty much the only difference.

Another good source is the Maximizing Image Detail section in the book The Digital Negative, by Jeff Schewe. He and Martin are both members of PixelGenius, which among other things laid out the principles for Adobe to implement in the Output Sharpening options in the Export dialog box and Print module in Lightroom.

And, of course, we have to mention the Detail — Sharpening and Noise Reduction section in Victoria’s own Lightroom Classic: The Missing FAQ book. It has a lot of good explanations, and recommendations for starting points for setting the options.
 
Johan, I did see that. If you scroll to bottom of page did you notice the date is 2018? How many changes have there been to the develop module tools since 2018?
From the top of my head I’d say “zero“ when we are talking about sharpening. That is probably why that page wasn’t updated since then.
 
The Adobe article is very basic, and doesn’t cover some of the key strategies for sharpening with Lightroom. Google found a great PDF article by Martin Evening, which discusses in detail some of the most important concepts: How to set the Sharpening options, how to mitigate side effects of sharpening by using (and visualizing) the Masking option, and how to think about the Noise Reduction options. It’s about Adobe Camera Raw, but the same control set is used in Lightroom.
Camera Raw Sharpening and Noise Reduction

Now, because of the concerns about outdated tutorials, it would be worth bringing up that the article is 12 years old. Is that a big deal? No. If you look at the screen shots, the Sharpening panel is identical to what is in the current version of Lightroom. The only visible difference is a new-ish Smoothness option in the Noise Reduction section. That option helps with high ISO images that have visible low-frequency color noise; that is, big splotches instead of tiny speckles. But that’s pretty much the only difference.

Another good source is the Maximizing Image Detail section in the book The Digital Negative, by Jeff Schewe. He and Martin are both members of PixelGenius, which among other things laid out the principles for Adobe to implement in the Output Sharpening options in the Export dialog box and Print module in Lightroom.

And, of course, we have to mention the Detail — Sharpening and Noise Reduction section in Victoria’s own Lightroom Classic: The Missing FAQ book. It has a lot of good explanations, and recommendations for starting points for setting the options.
@Conrad Chavez thanks for all the great information I'll bookmark your reply and use it as a reference. I know you say the detail section has changed very little but what about the section above basic section that contains the crop, spot removal, red eye, and masking tools? Don't they allow for targeted adjustments utilizing the options available in the detail section?
As you have no doubt ascertained, even though I'm a long time Lightroom Classic user, I am woefully inadequate with digital image correction. Except for very minimal image adjustment which mimmick dark room such as dodging and burning, I primarily use Lightroom as a DAM tool. As a matter of fact, before I went to Lightroom 3 I used PS Express or what is now Corel Paint Shop, or camera manufacturer software for image processing. I used BreezeBrowser Pro for image browsing along with Downloader Pro for importing to storage. In fact, if not for the robust search and catalog features of Lightroom I'd still be using Downloader Pro. So as you can tell I am somewhat of a dinosaur when it comes to digital photography. Heck, I still use DSLRs, technically DSLTs. I don't feel the need or have the $$$$ to switch to mirrorless.
 
@Conrad Chavez thanks for all the great information I'll bookmark your reply and use it as a reference. I know you say the detail section has changed very little but what about the section above basic section that contains the crop, spot removal, red eye, and masking tools? Don't they allow for targeted adjustments utilizing the options available in the detail section?
As you have no doubt ascertained, even though I'm a long time Lightroom Classic user, I am woefully inadequate with digital image correction. Except for very minimal image adjustment which mimmick dark room such as dodging and burning, I primarily use Lightroom as a DAM tool. As a matter of fact, before I went to Lightroom 3 I used PS Express or what is now Corel Paint Shop, or camera manufacturer software for image processing. I used BreezeBrowser Pro for image browsing along with Downloader Pro for importing to storage. In fact, if not for the robust search and catalog features of Lightroom I'd still be using Downloader Pro. So as you can tell I am somewhat of a dinosaur when it comes to digital photography. Heck, I still use DSLRs, technically DSLTs. I don't feel the need or have the $$$$ to switch to mirrorless.
If there is another Lightroom summit being held this year, I would strongly encourage you to give it consideration. They just announced a Photoshop summit, so I am hopeful that they are also planning another LR Summit. I am sure it will be posted here in the forum by Paul or Victoria if/when it is announced.

--Ken
 
If there is another Lightroom summit being held this year, I would strongly encourage you to give it consideration. They just announced a Photoshop summit, so I am hopeful that they are also planning another LR Summit. I am sure it will be posted here in the forum by Paul or Victoria if/when it is announced.

--Ken
Hi @Replytoken thanks for the suggestion. The issue I have with the webinars/summits and tutorials is I am still an old school learner. I learn best if I can follow along as the topic is being presented. Most webinars and videos require that you just watch and apply later. I know I could do a side-by-side screen but I have only a laptop now so there is not enough screen to watch videos and have the app open at same time. The other thing about the webinars is that they keep talking! They don't illustrate the concept then give you time to perform the concept. Presenters are focused on getting as much content as possible within the time allotted so they can say they gave you the most bang for buck. I think I'm going to have to take a continuing education class at the local university. It's a personal problem I know. :)
 
Hi @Replytoken thanks for the suggestion. The issue I have with the webinars/summits and tutorials is I am still an old school learner. I learn best if I can follow along as the topic is being presented. Most webinars and videos require that you just watch and apply later. I know I could do a side-by-side screen but I have only a laptop now so there is not enough screen to watch videos and have the app open at same time. The other thing about the webinars is that they keep talking! They don't illustrate the concept then give you time to perform the concept. Presenters are focused on getting as much content as possible within the time allotted so they can say they gave you the most bang for buck. I think I'm going to have to take a continuing education class at the local university. It's a personal problem I know. :)
If you purchased a ticket to the summit, you had unlimited to the recordings of each instructor. Free guests could only watch the videos for a day or two. And many of the instructors did actually demonstrate their techniques in real time. So, you could use two screens and stop and start the video as needed. I was a free guest last year and would probably buy a ticket this year. I learned a lot of new techniques from some of the videos. They will probably have some samples or allow you to convert from free to paid during the summit. It is worth consideration.

--Ken
 
I know you say the detail section has changed very little but what about the section above basic section that contains the crop, spot removal, red eye, and masking tools? Don't they allow for targeted adjustments utilizing the options available in the detail section?
Oh, in that case, sure there have been some changes. The reason I didn’t mention them is the first post asked about “sharpening images,” so I think we assumed that meant the Detail panel. If you’re asking about the tool strip, then the Crop, Spot Removal, and Red Eye tools actually have not changed much over the years, and don’t affect sharpening anyway.

However, local adjustments have undergone a major change. For many years, the gradient, radial, and adjustment brush tools were the last three on that strip. But recently — and this is definitely something that trips up a lot of new learners — local adjustments were completely redesigned, with new capabilities, under what is now the Masking tool, the new fourth tool on that strip.

What used to be three tools (gradient, radial, and adjustment brush) with refinements such as range masks, are now eight tools that can be combined in ways that were not possible before:
Select Subject and Select Sky – machine learning automatically identifies the subject or sky of the photo, and creates a mask.
Brush, Linear Gradient, and Radial Gradient — the current versions of the traditional local adjustment tools.
Color Range, Luminance Range, and Depth Range — the range masks, which can now be applied on their own. In the past, they could be applied only as modifications to other mask types.

I keep finding older tutorials that don't take into account the latest updates. Thanks
The way to get current info is to check the Lightroom Classic version used in the tutorial. To describe the changes above, it must cover Lightroom Classic 11 or later.

It is definitely true that there are years and years of tutorials that are not going to go away, describing how it worked from Lightroom (Classic) 1 through 10. Some of those still have good information you can use; just keep in mind that the three tools they cover are now sub-tools of Masking. They also will not go into the important new ways to combine masks in Lightroom Classic 11 and later, such as Add, Subtract, and Intersect.

For current information, Victoria’s books are consistently useful because she is very reliable about keeping them up to date.
 
If you purchased a ticket to the summit, you had unlimited to the recordings of each instructor. Free guests could only watch the videos for a day or two. And many of the instructors did actually demonstrate their techniques in real time. So, you could use two screens and stop and start the video as needed. I was a free guest last year and would probably buy a ticket this year. I learned a lot of new techniques from some of the videos. They will probably have some samples or allow you to convert from free to paid during the summit. It is worth consideration.

--Ken
Hi Ken @Replytoken;
I did free sign up for photoshop summit. I see someone is doing a beginners PS presentation. Maybe it will help me. Thanks
Regards
 
Hi Ken @Replytoken;
I did free sign up for photoshop summit. I see someone is doing a beginners PS presentation. Maybe it will help me. Thanks
Regards
I believe it is the same crew that puts on both summits, so hopefully the PS one will give you a taste of how they are run. But as I do not know that for certain, I would also watch for the LR version in case it is put together differently. Hope it works out for you.

--Ken
 
If you wish to understand the nuts and bolts of Sharpening... I can recommend this book. My copy is well thumbed up at the corners....

The advantage of a book is you can refer back to it at anytime. Many of the current tools and techniques are much more understandable if the basics under the hood are first understood.

I am sure it is available thru multiple different e-stores and may even be worth buying a second hand version...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/World-Shar...ruce+fraser+sharpening,digital-text,27&sr=1-1


1649686812596.png
 
I'll second that. All the "Real World" books that I've read have been excellent sources of information.
 
If you wish to understand the nuts and bolts of Sharpening... I can recommend this book. My copy is well thumbed up at the corners....

The advantage of a book is you can refer back to it at anytime. Many of the current tools and techniques are much more understandable if the basics under the hood are first understood.

I am sure it is available thru multiple different e-stores and may even be worth buying a second hand version...

https://www.amazon.co.uk/World-Sharpening-Photoshop-Camera-Lightroom-ebook/dp/B002NQSMWW/ref=sr_1_1?crid=1KECLNY7N7WKZ&keywords=bruce+fraser+sharpening&qid=1649686788&s=digital-text&sprefix=bruce+fraser+sharpening,digital-text,27&sr=1-1


View attachment 18467
Hi @Gnits;
Thanks for the book suggestion. I checked and I can get the Kindle Edition for $30 US. There is a used paper edition for $19.94 but I have Kindles, so I think I'll get the Kindle edition. I've got too many paper books setting around collection dust now.
 
Oh, in that case, sure there have been some changes. The reason I didn’t mention them is the first post asked about “sharpening images,” so I think we assumed that meant the Detail panel. If you’re asking about the tool strip, then the Crop, Spot Removal, and Red Eye tools actually have not changed much over the years, and don’t affect sharpening anyway.

However, local adjustments have undergone a major change. For many years, the gradient, radial, and adjustment brush tools were the last three on that strip. But recently — and this is definitely something that trips up a lot of new learners — local adjustments were completely redesigned, with new capabilities, under what is now the Masking tool, the new fourth tool on that strip.

What used to be three tools (gradient, radial, and adjustment brush) with refinements such as range masks, are now eight tools that can be combined in ways that were not possible before:
Select Subject and Select Sky – machine learning automatically identifies the subject or sky of the photo, and creates a mask.
Brush, Linear Gradient, and Radial Gradient — the current versions of the traditional local adjustment tools.
Color Range, Luminance Range, and Depth Range — the range masks, which can now be applied on their own. In the past, they could be applied only as modifications to other mask types.


The way to get current info is to check the Lightroom Classic version used in the tutorial. To describe the changes above, it must cover Lightroom Classic 11 or later.

It is definitely true that there are years and years of tutorials that are not going to go away, describing how it worked from Lightroom (Classic) 1 through 10. Some of those still have good information you can use; just keep in mind that the three tools they cover are now sub-tools of Masking. They also will not go into the important new ways to combine masks in Lightroom Classic 11 and later, such as Add, Subtract, and Intersect.

For current information, Victoria’s books are consistently useful because she is very reliable about keeping them up to date.
What used to be three tools (gradient, radial, and adjustment brush) with refinements such as range masks, are now eight tools that can be combined in ways that were not possible before:
Select Subject and Select Sky – machine learning automatically identifies the subject or sky of the photo, and creates a mask.
Brush, Linear Gradient, and Radial Gradient — the current versions of the traditional local adjustment tools.
Color Range, Luminance Range, and Depth Range — the range masks, which can now be applied on their own. In the past, they could be applied only as modifications to other mask types.
I'm sorry I accidentally quoted your full message. Apparently I can't even master using this forum so no wonder I'm having trouble with PS and LrC develop module. ;)
Anyway, I can't even see how to get to Select Subject and Select Sky or any of the other adjustment tools you mention above in LrC. I only see the crop, spot removal, red eye correction and Masking (Shift+W) options. Are those others only in PS? I'm obviously confuse.
If I select a subject (a person) can I invert to select just the surrounding area?
 
Last edited:
Anyway, I can't even see how to get to Select Subject and Select Sky or any of the other adjustment tools you mention above in LrC. I only see the crop, spot removal, red eye correction and Masking (Shift+W) options. Are those others only in PS? I'm obviously confuse.
If I select a subject (a person) can I invert to select just the surrounding area?
They are part of the masking tools. Click on the Masking tool icon and all will be revealed. For an in-depth read on the new Masking, I suggest you start with the new section (called Develop Masking) that Victoria added to your Missing FAQ book. It starts on page 758. And yes, you can invert the selection.
 
Anyway, I can't even see how to get to Select Subject and Select Sky or any of the other adjustment tools you mention above in LrC. I only see the crop, spot removal, red eye correction and Masking (Shift+W) options. Are those others only in PS? I'm obviously confuse.
If I select a subject (a person) can I invert to select just the surrounding area?
Admittedly, it’s a little confusing that where to create a new mask changes depending on whether an image has existing masks or not; see the demo below.

Lightroom Classic 11 masks v00.gif


When a mask is selected, you can see an Invert check box, so you can invert a Select Subject to get its background.

For the rest of it, like the others are saying, it’s all explained in the current materials, including the books by Victoria who runs this Lightroom Queen web site.
 
Solution
Admittedly, it’s a little confusing that where to create a new mask changes depending on whether an image has existing masks or not; see the demo below.

View attachment 18468

When a mask is selected, you can see an Invert check box, so you can invert a Select Subject to get its background.

For the rest of it, like the others are saying, it’s all explained in the current materials, including the books by Victoria who runs this Lightroom Queen web site.
I see, thanks.
 
Kindle or Paper Editions.
I prefer to get paper editions of technical manuals, as it is easier to deal with diagrams, reference index and other lists. Also, on some books I am happy to write notes or insert notes into the book. The well worn pages become another index of sorts.

In this case, I would consider a second hand book to be good value. Also, I am not up to speed with editions and references to the latest versions of software. However, the fundamentals of sharpening have not changed and this book is a good primer for understanding many of the current popular sharpening tools.
 
Kindle or Paper Editions.
I prefer to get paper editions of technical manuals, as it is easier to deal with diagrams, reference index and other lists. Also, on some books I am happy to write notes or insert notes into the book. The well worn pages become another index of sorts.

In this case, I would consider a second hand book to be good value. Also, I am not up to speed with editions and references to the latest versions of software. However, the fundamentals of sharpening have not changed and this book is a good primer for understanding many of the current popular sharpening tools.
I completely understand the benefits of paper. However, I have learned to make annotations, bookmarks etc in my Kindle Fire and even in the lesser Kindle reader so in my opinion the benefits of using the Kindle Fire or Reader are at least on par with paper with far less storage needs. Not to mention it's much easier to carry a Kindle on an airplane. Over the past few years, I have donated lots of books to the local library because I no longer have the space. For example, I recently gave over 30 years of National Geographic print magazine and a DVD collection back to the beginning of the magazine.
 
I generally no longer sharpen my images in LrC / Camera RAW. After pre-processing my RAW images in DxO PhotoLab Elite I use Topaz Sharpen AI for output sharpening. I use LrC for DAM and for editing these pre-processed images prior to sharpening. If required, I will use PS and the TK8 tools from Tony Kuper.
 
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