I swore I would never do it...

[rebop]

Lightroom Version

6

Operating System

1. Windows 10

But now I *might*.

Now fully mirrorless, CR3 not supported by LR 6 I find I have several choices:

1. Convert from RAW to TIF in DPP, which works well, but is slow and larger files. No lens corrections then.
2. Use Adobe DNG, but very unhappy with the results when taken into LR 6.
3. Convert to TIF in DXO Pureraw 3. Slow, but noit a bad solution with great noise and lens corrections.

I also exhaustively reviewed almost all alternatives to LR Classic - ON1, Capture One, Skylum, DXO Photolab, Darktable, etc, etc. The only one that resonated at all is Photolab 6. But no tethering, Web Galleries (which I use monthly) unsure on Panoramas, book layouts, etc. So I would keep LR 6 for "some" of that. I have not done the trial on DXO.

So unless I am missing something "that works well for me", its Photolab 6 or Lightroom Classic

First concern with Classic, aside from being allergic to subscriptions, is CPU and Memory usage, particularlry with "phoning home" and even when no Adobe app is open. I have read a LOT about this. Hate it. I dislike processes running that are unneeded and use my CPU and RAM for more than just photography as a power user.

Second are questions I have not "yet" found answers to:

1. I know I can install Classic and LR 6 on the same machine, but can they use the same catalog?
2. Can they use the same plugins, splash screen, watermarks, identity plates, etc from the same location on my computer?
3. Can they use the same plugins such as focus point (which I like) and web gallery plugins?
4. Can Classic edit in the older Google version NIK plugins?
5. Can I copy over export presets, preferences, etc?

So now on the journey to make THIS decision. Will have to trial Photolab 6 as cannot make an indformed decision if I do not do it first hand. Appreciate any insights or tales of your experiences.

 

[clee01l]

But now I *might*.

Now fully mirrorless, CR3 not supported by LR 6 I find I have several choices:

Second are questions I have not "yet" found answers to:

1. I know I can install Classic and LR 6 on the same machine, but can they use the same catalog?
2. Can they use the same plugins, splash screen, watermarks, identity plates, etc from the same location on my computer?
3. Can they use the same plugins such as focus point (which I like) and web gallery plugins?
4. Can Classic edit in the older Google version NIK plugins?
5. Can I copy over export presets, preferences, etc?

So now on the journey to make THIS decision. Will have to trial Photolab 6 as cannot make an indformed decision if I do not do it first hand. Appreciate any insights or tales of your experiences.

4) The data base structures usually change with each version up grade. A LR6 catalog will be converted to LrC v12.x and use by the current version of LrC. It can not be used by LR6 due to the difference in the database structure that is not understandable by LR6.

5) Plugins may need to be updated to the current LrC version but otherwise everything is converted from the LR6 catalog to the LrC v12 catalog file and can be used seamlessly with LrC.
6) (See #5)
7) NIK plugins are likely obsolete. IIRC there are newer version of the NIK plugins designed to work with modern operating systems.
8) The Lightroom Settings folder is used to store your presets. This same folder will be used by LrC.

Most of us using LrC upgraded from LR6 a long time ago. Very few people are still using LR6 which has not been supported for some time and is now very much out of date.

You can install a trial version of the Photography Plan which included LrC, LR (cloud based) and Photoshop. Using it will copy and convert your LR6 catalog to LRCv12 leaving the LR6 catalog as is in case you reject the trial.

If you decide to purchase the Photography Plan it will cost you ~$120/year. If you decide to unsubscribe, the LrC app will still work with a reduced functionality.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[rebop]

Cletus wrote:
4) The data base structures usually change with each version up grade. A LR6 catalog will be converted to LrC v12.x and use by the current version of LrC. It can not be used by LR6 due to the difference in the database structure that is not understandable by LR6.

OK. So if I edit an image in Classic assuming I am using the same image(s) in both versions of LR, what happens to it when opened in LR 6?

And out of date is in the wallet of the beholder LR6 serves me incredibly well through today.

Thanks.

 

[Hal P Anderson]

OK. So if I edit an image in Classic assuming I am using the same image(s) in both versions of LR, what happens to it when opened in LR 6?

You won't see the changes. In general, it's a terrible idea to have the same photo in two different LRC catalogues, even if the catalogues are from the same version of Lightroom. It's a recipe for major confusion.

 

[clee01l]

…OK. So if I edit an image in Classic assuming I am using the same image(s) in both versions of LR, what happens to it when opened in LR 6?

And out of date is in the wallet of the beholder LR6 serves me incredibly well through today.

Thanks.

You will see the same image in each catalog file. Lightroom Changes are stored in the catalog file not applied to the original image. If you make changes to an image in LrC, opening the LR6 catalog file will not show those changes.
Changes made in the old catalog after it was copied to the new catalog file will not be available in the new LrC catalog.

Once you accept the newest version of LrC, there is no going back to the LR6 version. You can only use one catalog for your images. If you reject the LrC app. You can only continue in LR6 with your data as it was when in LR6

You mentioned another app as an alternative to LrC If you go to this other app. You start over and lose all of the work you did in LR6. If instead you upgrade yo LrC, all of the work you did in LR6 is carried forward to LRC and you lose none of the work you have done in Lightroom


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Johan Elzenga]

Convert to TIF in DXO Pureraw 3. Slow, but noit a bad solution with great noise and lens corrections.

If I am not mistaken, then you can convert to linear DNG in Pureraw 3. That is the same kind of DNG that Lightroom creates when merging to panorama or HDR, or when applying the new AI Denoise. Technically this is not a raw file, but it behaves like one (no white balance baked in, still accepts camera profiles).

 

[rebop]

Agree, Johan. Not sure if DNG or TIF in that process has an advantage. Time consumming. ,another step and another program. But not out of the question. And then, I would stay with LR6 and miss a few new features.

Tough decision, at least for me.

 

[Zenon]

1. Convert from RAW to TIF in DPP, which works well, but is slow and larger files. No lens corrections then.

Why no lens correction? Any adjustments you make using DPP are retained when you convert and save to a TFF or Jpeg.

 

[Zenon]

But now I *might*.

Now fully mirrorless, CR3 not supported by LR 6 I find I have several choices:

1. Convert from RAW to TIF in DPP, which works well, but is slow and larger files. No lens corrections then.
2. Use Adobe DNG, but very unhappy with the results when taken into LR 6.
3. Convert to TIF in DXO Pureraw 3. Slow, but noit a bad solution with great noise and lens corrections.

I also exhaustively reviewed almost all alternatives to LR Classic - ON1, Capture One, Skylum, DXO Photolab, Darktable, etc, etc. The only one that resonated at all is Photolab 6. But no tethering, Web Galleries (which I use monthly) unsure on Panoramas, book layouts, etc. So I would keep LR 6 for "some" of that. I have not done the trial on DXO.

So unless I am missing something "that works well for me", its Photolab 6 or Lightroom Classic

First concern with Classic, aside from being allergic to subscriptions, is CPU and Memory usage, particularlry with "phoning home" and even when no Adobe app is open. I have read a LOT about this. Hate it. I dislike processes running that are unneeded and use my CPU and RAM for more than just photography as a power user.

Second are questions I have not "yet" found answers to:

1. I know I can install Classic and LR 6 on the same machine, but can they use the same catalog?
2. Can they use the same plugins, splash screen, watermarks, identity plates, etc from the same location on my computer?
3. Can they use the same plugins such as focus point (which I like) and web gallery plugins?
4. Can Classic edit in the older Google version NIK plugins?
5. Can I copy over export presets, preferences, etc?

So now on the journey to make THIS decision. Will have to trial Photolab 6 as cannot make an indformed decision if I do not do it first hand. Appreciate any insights or tales of your experiences.

LrC 12.3 introduced Adobe Denoise AI. It is very good and will only get better. The Photo Plan also comes with a personal website that is integrated with LrC. You can create up to 5 sites.

DXO is makes a very good product but it is on an annual upgrade program. Every fall has a new version upgrade. You don't have to upgrade but DXO adds new versions of DeepPrime every year. It was Prime a few years ago, then DeepPrime and last fall it was DeepPrime XD. I'm pretty sure it will be DeepPrime DX SD or Super Duper. Just made that up but there will be a noise AI upgrade.

If you get PL6 today, PL7 will come in this fall and you won't get 8 months credit. You will have to pay for the full upgrade price to get it, if you want it. You have to buy PL within 30 days of a new version release to get a free upgrade. Also shortly after the annual fall version upgrade DXO products go on sale during the BF sales.

I'm not saying that is a bad thing. That is DXO's business model. Not all are aware so I like to mention it.

 

[rebop]

If I am not incorrect, simply opening in DPP and converting to TIF does not apply lens correction. Could be wrong....

 

[rebop]

LrC 12.3 introduced Adobe Denoise AI. It is very good and will only get better. The Photo Plan also comes with a personal website that is integrated with LrC. You can create up to 5 sites.

DXO is makes a very good product but it is on an annual upgrade program. Every fall has a new version upgrade. You don't have to upgrade but DXO adds new versions of DeepPrime every year. It was Prime a few years ago, then DeepPrime and last fall it was DeepPrime XD. I'm pretty sure it will be DeepPrime DX SD or Super Duper. Just made that up but there will be a noise AI upgrade.

If you get PL6 today, PL7 will come in this fall and you won't get 8 months credit. You will have to pay for the full upgrade price to get it, if you want it. You have to buy PL within 30 days of a new version release to get a free upgrade. Also shortly after the annual fall version upgrade DXO products go on sale during the BF sales.

I'm not saying that is a bad thing. That is DXO's business model. Not all are aware so I like to mention it.

Appreciate it. Good info.

 

[rebop]

So let me see if I understand an earlier post:
IF I have pictures in a catolog processed iwht LR6 and open them in CLassic they WILL display with all edits and changes, yes? BUT if I edit them now in Classic. they can nver bee edited in LR6 again. Is that correct? And wil they display properly in LR6? Unsure exactly what limitations are here.

 

[Johan Elzenga]

So let me see if I understand an earlier post:
IF I have pictures in a catolog processed iwht LR6 and open them in CLassic they WILL display with all edits and changes, yes? BUT if I edit them now in Classic. they can nver bee edited in LR6 again. Is that correct? And wil they display properly in LR6? Unsure exactly what limitations are here.

No, not quite. It's not the pictures, it's the catalog. Edits are saved in the catalog and catalogs are not backwards compatible. That means you cannot open a Lightroom Classic catalog in Lightroom 6 and continue to work with that catalog in Lightroom 6. But nothing happens to the pictures, so editing these in Lightroom Classic does not mean you could not edit them anymore in Lightroom 6. You could, but you would have to start all over again, or continue with the old LR6 catalog (the catalog upgrade creates a copy, so you will still have the old LR6 catalog).

 

[rebop]

No, not quite. It's not the pictures, it's the catalog. Edits are saved in the catalog and catalogs are not backwards compatible. That means you cannot open a Lightroom Classic catalog in Lightroom 6 and continue to work with that catalog in Lightroom 6. But nothing happens to the pictures, so editing these in Lightroom Classic does not mean you could not edit them anymore in Lightroom 6. You could, but you would have to start all over again, or continue with the old LR6 catalog (the catalog upgrade creates a copy, so you will still have the old LR6 catalog).

This is even if I am using xmp sidecars?

 

[Zenon]

If I am not incorrect, simply opening in DPP and converting to TIF does not apply lens correction. Could be wrong....

Perhaps we were talking about two different things. I was talking about DLO which is true digital lens corrections. You can have that turned on in the camera or activate it while in DPP. Once you’ve done that it will apply to your exported files. So when you open that file in your current LR you won’t need any lens corrections.

LR or LrC themselves don’t recognize DLO,

 

[vbnut]

FWIW, I swore I would never do it too, and when I switched to mirrorless last year I was in the same boat as you (except I was using LR 5.7.1 because LR 6 didn't add anything of value for me). I tried your option 2 (Adobe DNG Converter) for a few months, but didn't like the workflow and the increase in storage space. I had been looking at a couple of open-source alternatives (digikam and darktable), and I might still switch to them eventually, but the learning curve will be steep resulting in a painful transition, so I purchased the photography plan from Amazon (because apparently you can cancel at the end of any month without penalty - unlike purchasing directly from Adobe).

After installation, I launched LrC and opened my catalog, and it asked me if it was OK to convert LR 5.71 catalog to the new format, and when I said yes it created a new LR 12 catalog from the 5.7.1catalog. The 5.7.1catalog is still there and I can still open it with LR 5.7.1, but the changes I've made usingLrC are not visible in LR 5.7.1. Similarly, if I used LR 5.7.1 to make changes to the 5.7.1 catalog (I haven't done that) those changes would not be visible in LrC 12. They really are 2 different catalogs one of which can only be used with LR 5.7.1 and other can only be used with LrC 12.

I'm basically using the same workflow I've used for years, and slowly incorporating a few of the new features to (hopefully) improve my post processing results. Specifically I've switched to making some of my adjustments "locally" using the AI masks, specifically the subject mask. I've also found that the new AI Denoise is a game changer.

Even though I'm just a hobbyist, I've realized that I can afford $9.99/month, and although I have objections on principle to subscription software and don't use Photoshop or any of the cloud service stuff, I suspect I'll be staying with the photography plan for the foreseeable future.

BTW, @Zenon mentioned the personal website. I assume he is referring to Adobe Portfolio. I played around with it, tjhinking it might be a replacement for my Zenfolio unlimited account, but as far as I can tell, it really is targeted at a portfolio displaying a pretty limited number of images, not a photo sharing website for organizing and displaying a large number of images (my Zenfolio site contains more than 10000 images in more than 750 albums). Of course YMMV.

 

[rebop]

Thanks for that. Thoughtful.

So question still remains in my mind if there is a difference if you are storing changes in the catalog or xmp file. Does that make a difference.? Have not seen that addressed.

And if I follow above, then I ALWAYS would have the ability to go back to 6 and only lose the new changes to an image done in CLassic - yes?

And does anyone experience the high CPU and RAM use issues even when LR or PS is NOT running?

 

[Paul_DS256]

So question still remains in my mind if there is a difference if you are storing changes in the catalog or xmp file. Does that make a difference.? Have not seen that addressed.

Not all changes are saved in the XMP and some LR6 will not know what to do with them from LRC. I use LR6 on an old MACBook for travelling. I can bring the photos and XMPs forward to LRC. The only reason I don’t have LRC on the MACBook is that I can’t install the minimum OS needed for LRC.

As to the subscription model, I was reluctant but enjoy it now. It gets me Photoshop which I don’t use that much but is good to have. Also there is an increased frequency of new features. Since you have made the change to the latest in hardware with mirrorless, I’d suggest you do a cost benefit analysis of going subscription.

 

[Zenon]

FWIW, I swore I would never do it too, and when I switched to mirrorless last year I was in the same boat as you (except I was using LR 5.7.1 because LR 6 didn't add anything of value for me). I tried your option 2 (Adobe DNG Converter) for a few months, but didn't like the workflow and the increase in storage space. I had been looking at a couple of open-source alternatives (digikam and darktable), and I might still switch to them eventually, but the learning curve will be steep resulting in a painful transition, so I purchased the photography plan from Amazon (because apparently you can cancel at the end of any month without penalty - unlike purchasing directly from Adobe).

After installation, I launched LrC and opened my catalog, and it asked me if it was OK to convert LR 5.71 catalog to the new format, and when I said yes it created a new LR 12 catalog from the 5.7.1catalog. The 5.7.1catalog is still there and I can still open it with LR 5.7.1, but the changes I've made usingLrC are not visible in LR 5.7.1. Similarly, if I used LR 5.7.1 to make changes to the 5.7.1 catalog (I haven't done that) those changes would not be visible in LrC 12. They really are 2 different catalogs one of which can only be used with LR 5.7.1 and other can only be used with LrC 12.

I'm basically using the same workflow I've used for years, and slowly incorporating a few of the new features to (hopefully) improve my post processing results. Specifically I've switched to making some of my adjustments "locally" using the AI masks, specifically the subject mask. I've also found that the new AI Denoise is a game changer.

Even though I'm just a hobbyist, I've realized that I can afford $9.99/month, and although I have objections on principle to subscription software and don't use Photoshop or any of the cloud service stuff, I suspect I'll be staying with the photography plan for the foreseeable future.

BTW, @Zenon mentioned the personal website. I assume he is referring to Adobe Portfolio. I played around with it, tjhinking it might be a replacement for my Zenfolio unlimited account, but as far as I can tell, it really is targeted at a portfolio displaying a pretty limited number of images, not a photo sharing website for organizing and displaying a large number of images (my Zenfolio site contains more than 10000 images in more than 750 albums). Of course YMMV.

I rarely use PS these days as well. Yes I was talking about Portfolio. I once used Zenfolio but it was overkill for my needs. I keep adding photos and have not hit any limits yet but I'm no where near you. I just show some of favourite images. The money I saved dropping Zenfolio pretty much pays for the Adobe Plan.

 

[Hal P Anderson]

So question still remains in my mind if there is a difference if you are storing changes in the catalog or xmp file. Does that make a difference.? Have not seen that addressed.

You always store changes in the catalogue. Storing changes in the XMP files is an option. If you store them there from LRC 12, LR6 will apply the ones it understands, but there will be many changes that are unique to 12 and LR6 will ignore them. IMO, it isn't worth it.

 

[Zenon]

When I went subscription in 2017 I kept LR6 and the catalogue for a year. By the time LrC 8 came out I new I could never go back to LR6 so I deleted it and the LR6 catalogue. Back then if I had not wanted to continue with LrC I would have gone with a different developer before going back to LR6.

Nothing wrong with LR6. After a year of LrC 7, I just couldn’t go backward after getting used to the new features.

 

[clee01l]

And if I follow above, then I ALWAYS would have the ability to go back to 6 and only lose the new changes to an image done in CLassic - yes?

And does anyone experience the high CPU and RAM use issues even when LR or PS is NOT running?

Also images imported into the LrC catalog file would not be seen in the Older LR6 catalog.

If LrC and PS are not running. any high CPU and RAM use issues would be caused by other apps. Adobe Background tasks use a negligible amount of CPU

 

[rebop]

Also images imported into the LrC catalog file would not be seen in the Older LR6 catalog.

If LrC and PS are not running. any high CPU and RAM use issues would be caused by other apps. Adobe Background tasks use a negligible amount of CPU

LOTS of reports online that claim otherwise on that. I have no first hand info. But some say Sync and Creative Cloud are culprits.

Also looked at Amazon for Photography Package and did not see a LR Classic and PS package. Just Creative Cloud Photography. Is it possible you select which when buying and downloading that? And I'll assume that paying with your Prime CC nets the 5% discount.

Leaning more to LRC but still considering Photlab or Puireview with LR 6. More research and deciding to be done. Helpful input here. Much appreciated.

 

[Zenon]

Not sure I'd trust some of those online sources. When you update to LrC it creates a new catalogue and merges the data from old one (LR6) into it. Thus when using LrC the LR6 I ignored so I can't see how it would recognize whatever you did using LrC. It does keep the Lr6 catalogue around.

If you create two catalogues (which most don't recommend) you have to log out of one to log into the other one and the file directory will be different.

 

[Zenon]

Just as a follow up. If you want to work with a TIFF in LR6 here is the lens module in DPP. When you activate it corrects for convolution. It automatically applies Diffraction and CA plus you can add Color Blur, Distortion and a few other things. When you Convert and Save all these settings apply to the TIFF. I wish I could use DLO but I prefer to work in LrC with RAW files.