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Exported photos OOF

Chessman

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Hi..last time I was asking a question in this forum it was a problem with my Lr6.14 standalone and ON1. many editing problems. Despite suggested solutions I wasn't able to resolve the issue because the fault lay with ON1. A friend was having the same issues . Fair play to ON1 we both received a full refund for the Raw 2019 version. I seem to be plagued with problems not only with photo editing but my 11 month old 27" iMac had to have a new power supply unit then photos and screen grabs put into Emails showed the top half of the photo and the rest of the full width photo down to the bottom thousands of very fine coloured lines..like arty wallpapewr. Text in screen grabs looked like it would if looking at it in a convex mirror..distorted. It took Apple several efforts over a few weeks to sort it including taking remote control of my iMac. That's been sorted now.

With Lr4 I used Elements11 for cloning and selective sharpening (usually birds) and NIK (as was) Define2 for NR. It worked very well for years until I got the new iMac at which point Elements 11 and Define2 could not be read/recognised by it. I don't do a massive amount of photography..steam locos,birds,miltary and commercial aircraft as and when and the usual holiday photos so I went for ON1 which was not a success as outlined above. I decided to sign up to subscription Lr Classic (July 30th )and now I have a new issue..

Prior to the current problem I've posted my steam loco photos in a couple of forums and sent them by Email to friends. These were at approximately 400-450Kb. The loco number on the boiler front was always sharp as was the one on the cab and the nameplate on the side of the boiler. This is no longer the case. At full size the photos are pin/tack sharp but not after compression to be able to post in a forum or included in an Email. I asked my friend, who also has Lr Classic and suggested I get it to resolve the above issues, if he was having the same issue with his photos..not steam locos ..and he does. I did a test with a steam loco re compression starting at Quality 100 - 90 - 75 - 50 - 30 -10. All turned out with exactly the same issue.

I've ticked the box for iMac High Sierra 10.13 but it's now 10.14.6 which isn't an option in the tick boxes here. I shoot in RAW. When I come to export a photo so I can post in a forum or Email it I select Jpeg and sRGB in the File Setting box. In the Quality box I select 80 - 90 The 'Limit file size box' is left unticked as is 'Don't Enlarge' I've tried 'Output sharpen for screen'..to no avail

For Image sizing I tick 'Resize to fit' and Long Edge 1200. I used to go for 'width/height 1000 x 1000. Infact I've just done that now and got an Email up and selected it from my Finder folder after expoprt and have the same result. I can't read the name of the loco and the boiler front number isn't sharp..so the issue remains the same. I've taken several loco photos over the past month and because of this issue haven't posted any, apart from two to ask in the forum if anyone knows why it's happening. There were no responses.Regarding sharpness quality of photos forums are unforgiving places.

The best example of the problem is with the maroon (British Rail Crimson Lake) Duchess of Sutherland. The first photo is Clun Castle. At full size both these photos are pin sharp. and the names can easily be read. Clun Castle , the first one..is in Finder at 703KB..The Duchess 635KB. Just to give a different subject I've just added a Rock Pipet bird. It's 361Kb. It should be sharper. I sharpened it in Lr Classic (Detail)

This problem has put a real damper on my enthusiasm for photographing steam locos but I still get out there to get the shots in the hope that this issue will eventually be resolved, otherwise I'm going to need councelling..lol.

703Kb
1. 100% (1 of 1).jpg


635Kb
35 (35 of 1).jpg


361Kb
34 (34 of 1).jpg
 
Joined
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Please send screen shots of your Export dialogue. Use as many as it takes to show the whole thing. Thanks.
 

Zenon

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The green train is 7029 and red is 6233. The names are smaller due to down-sampling. In all honesty I don't see anything wrong. Looks sharp to me.
 

Chessman

Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2018
Messages
28
Lightroom Experience
Intermediate
Lightroom Version
6.x
Please send screen shots of your Export dialogue. Use as many as it takes to show the whole thing. Thanks.
Thanks for response. I couldn't get the whole page in one screen grab .



Screenshot 2019-09-18 at 15.24.34.png


Screenshot 2019-09-18 at 15.24.55.png
 

Chessman

Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2018
Messages
28
Lightroom Experience
Intermediate
Lightroom Version
6.x
The green train is 7029 and red is 6233. The names are smaller due to down-sampling. In all honesty I don't see anything wrong. Looks sharp to me.
Hi..Here's a screen grab at 'Fit' and I can read the name. I'm not sure what 'Fit' size corresponds to, though..next ,as you'll know,is Fill .

Oh.. I'm unable to do that. A message states that it's too large. Something is definitely happening through the export process. One friend saw the issue and said not to worry about it being oof but it's not acceptable. Maybe Hal will come up with something re the export window (above)
 

Chessman

Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2018
Messages
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Lightroom Experience
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Lightroom Version
6.x
Please send screen shots of your Export dialogue. Use as many as it takes to show the whole thing. Thanks.
I've just seen in my paragraph 3 that a part of it doesn't make sense because I've missed out a word or two..typos..

What I meant to say was that my friend, who has Lr Classic suggested I sign up to it which I did. I then experienced the above export problem and I asked him if he had the same issues. He did a test and said yes, he does have the same oof issue.
 

Chessman

Member
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Jul 30, 2018
Messages
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Lightroom Experience
Intermediate
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Pardon my ignorance but what do you mean by "OOF"? I don't think that you mean "out of office".

-louie
Ah.. ....lol..No, not 'Out of Office' but that's good. Most people seem to write OOF for 'Out of Focus'
 
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The engine name on your second image is about 50 pixels long and has over a dozen letters. That's about 4 pixels wide for each letter, which is way too few pixels to draw a letter. I suspect that you're seeing lots more pixels per letter on your 5k monitor in "fit" mode. Lightroom Classic does a pretty good job on export, but it isn't magic. Try bumping the output size to 1800 on the long side and see how pleased you are.

In other words, Zenon is probably correct.
 

Zenon

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Your resolution is set for 72 which is fine. It can be set to 1000 and it won't make a difference for screen viewing. I just leave mine at my print resolution because it saves a step. Also saved a step creating export presets. You may have read you should set screen resolution at 72 but that is outdated. It came from the first monitors over 30 years ago.

Are you perhaps printing with those settings? Is that where you are seeing it not as crisp?
 

Zenon

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In case anyone is interested.

 

Chessman

Member
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Messages
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Lightroom Experience
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6.x
The engine name on your second image is about 50 pixels long and has over a dozen letters. That's about 4 pixels wide for each letter, which is way too few pixels to draw a letter. I suspect that you're seeing lots more pixels per letter on your 5k monitor in "fit" mode. Lightroom Classic does a pretty good job on export, but it isn't magic. Try bumping the output size to 1800 on the long side and see how pleased you are.

In other words, Zenon is probably correct.
Ok..thank you. I'll do that right now.



Your resolution is set for 72 which is fine. It can be set to 1000 and it won't make a difference for screen viewing. I just leave mine at my print resolution because it saves a step. Also saved a step creating export presets. You may have read you should set screen resolution at 72 but that is outdated. It came from the first monitors over 30 years ago.

Are you perhaps printing with those settings? Is that where you are seeing it not as crisp?

I'll try the 1800 that Hal has suggested and see how it goes. I set it at 72 because that's what my friend told me to do way back when I had Lr3 and first started and I've read it online too but point taken. I send any photos I want printing to Photobox. They use ink rather than laser.I read that only three companies use ink, which I've been told is better.
 

Zenon

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It won't hurt it but not important to do so. Try it for yourself if you feel like it. Output one at 1 and one at 1000. You won't see a difference. I have samples but I won't post this time.

Good luck
 

Chessman

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Messages
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It won't hurt it but not important to do so. Try it for yourself if you feel like it. Output one at 1 and one at 1000. You won't see a difference. I have samples but I won't post this time.

Good luck
The engine name on your second image is about 50 pixels long and has over a dozen letters. That's about 4 pixels wide for each letter, which is way too few pixels to draw a letter. I suspect that you're seeing lots more pixels per letter on your 5k monitor in "fit" mode. Lightroom Classic does a pretty good job on export, but it isn't magic. Try bumping the output size to 1800 on the long side and see how pleased you are.

In other words, Zenon is probably correct.
Zeno..I'll read that link later..quite a long read but very informative and useful..thanks for that, much appreciated

Hal...

Wow. .Brilliant. Much better at Long Side 1800. I can read the name. Duchess of Sutherland and Clun Castle is better too.

Really appreciate the help from both of you..Many thanks.
37 1800 Longside test (37 of 1).jpg


38. Clun Castle  1800 Longside test (38 of 1).jpg
 

Chessman

Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2018
Messages
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Lightroom Experience
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Lightroom Version
6.x
It won't hurt it but not important to do so. Try it for yourself if you feel like it. Output one at 1 and one at 1000. You won't see a difference. I have samples but I won't post this time.

Good luck
Just a quickie to wrap up. Shall I leave the resolution at 72, then ? I ask because you said it was fine at this value.. I had a quick overview of the article stating that 72 was in a by-gone age , as you mentioned but I didn't see, in a quick look, what it should currently be.
 

Chessman

Member
Joined
Jul 30, 2018
Messages
28
Lightroom Experience
Intermediate
Lightroom Version
6.x
The engine name on your second image is about 50 pixels long and has over a dozen letters. That's about 4 pixels wide for each letter, which is way too few pixels to draw a letter. I suspect that you're seeing lots more pixels per letter on your 5k monitor in "fit" mode. Lightroom Classic does a pretty good job on export, but it isn't magic. Try bumping the output size to 1800 on the long side and see how pleased you are.

In other words, Zenon is probably correct.
The green train is 7029 and red is 6233. The names are smaller due to down-sampling. In all honesty I don't see anything wrong. Looks sharp to me.

Looks like it isn't going to work in my main forum. Someone called Saintsfan (James) has asked about forum photo size. I checked the size of the 1800 Long Side photo. It's 1.5 Mb but the Long Side limit is 1024 .

 
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Looks like it isn't going to work in my main forum. Someone called Saintsfan (James) has asked about forum photo size. I checked the size of the 1800 Long Side photo. It's 1.5 Mb but the Long Side limit is 1024 .
Try dropping the quality slider down to 75, that should have no impact on the image but will have an impact on the size of the exported file.
 
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If you have a maximum of 1024 long side, you'll need to devote more pixels to the name. Try cropping tighter.
 

Chessman

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Try dropping the quality slider down to 75, that should have no impact on the image but will have an impact on the size of the exported file.
Dropped it 77 Quality. It gives the same 833Kb thast 75 does. I'll try it up one by one until it goes up on size and go it down to t 833KB which should be ok. It looks good to me. The blurring isn't there..it's just small. I took it to Q88 but that took it to 1.1MB so it looks like I've hit the max at Q77....Thanks,Jim.

40 (40 of 1).jpg
 

Zenon

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By the w
Just a quickie to wrap up. Shall I leave the resolution at 72, then ? I ask because you said it was fine at this value.. I had a quick overview of the article stating that 72 was in a by-gone age , as you mentioned but I didn't see, in a quick look, what it should currently be.
For screen that value is fine because PPI is only used for print resolution or basically printing.
 
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Dropped it 77 Quality. It gives the same 833Kb thast 75 does. I'll try it up one by one until it goes up on size and go it down to t 833KB which should be ok. It looks good to me. The blurring isn't there..it's just small. I took it to Q88 but that took it to 1.1MB so it looks like I've hit the max at Q77....Thanks,Jim.
For an explanation, have a read of this: An Analysis of Lightroom JPEG Export Quality Settings
 
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