DNG+jpej -what's this?

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Roy Mathers

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I have recently had to export some DNGs to large-file jpegs. In order to do this, I exported the DNGs as TIFFs, upsized them and then saved as jpegs. So far, so good.

When I next looked at the Library, I noticed that the DNGs I had used are now showing as DNG+jpeg. What has happened here?
 
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Roy, exactly what did you do? How did you export the files?

You could have just exported from LR as jpegs and set the size in the export menu without creating TIFFs in between.
 
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It was to send some pictures to a picture library who need an original file size of at least 48Mb. The method I used was the method they ask for ie save the RAW file as a TIFF, upsize it to the necessary size and then save as a jpeg. I think the reason for this is that the original (TIFF) has to be an uncompressed file size of at least 48Mb, whereas the submitted pic has to be a jpeg taken from that uncompressed file.
 
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Ok, got that.
How did you import the jpegs though??
 
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I'm even more confused now. I've just noticed that a great many of the pictures in this folder are showing as DNG+jpeg (it seems to be all the ones that I've given 5 stars to and subsequently printed). In the metadata panel on the RH side, it shows the sidecar file as a jpeg. is this the expanation? I don't recall asking for a sidecar file - how do I get rid of it? Or shouldn't I?
 
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Whacky Roy!!
Can you put up screen shots showing the grid/metadata view that shows this and one of the files on your HD. please?
 
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moz-screenshot.jpg
moz-screenshot-1.jpg
 
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My guess is that the JPEGs are sitting alongside the DNGs with the same filename, and at some point LR has gone to disk to check for sidecars (it's usually looking for .xmp files sitting alongside raw files) and discovered them.
 
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The thing is, I didn't re-import the jpegs once I had created them and, in the Catalog settings>Metadata tab, I have the 'Automatically write changes into xmp' tab unchecked. So how did LR know I had saved these jpegs, and why did it put them with the original DNGs (not stacked, mark you, but part of the same file)?
 
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And now you're stuck, there's no way to unglue the JPGs from the raw/DNG+JPG filetype.
(Well, you can write the metadata, remove all the files from LR, move/delete the paired JPGs from the target folder and reimport, but that's quite a hassle) There's no real harm done, except for the goofy file type.

I've never seen a cogent explanation of 'why' LR behaves like this. I know it's intended to deal with the raw+jpg shooter, from a file management perspective. Unfortunately it has the unintended consequence of seizing onto derivative JPGs saved back to the source directory.

In testing, I once just deleted the companion JPG, and requested a folder sync. I was asked if I wanted to ignore the missing sidecar. I said yes, but LR continued to show the file as CR2+JPG, so no practical result.

There definitley needs to be a way to break up the set, after the fact. I'll try to figure out how to word the feature request.

Edit, as to how it 'found them' without a specific sync/read request, I dunno, but it always seems to.
 
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It's actually a good thing.

The reason LR tries to pair up files with the same name and differing extensions is so that if you move or rename them, they all get moved or rename together. Since these JPEGs are derivatives of the DNG with the same name, you'd proabably want that to happen, right?
 
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Mark, I agree that *fundamentally, it's a good idea. I've encountered two problems with the current implementation:

1) On a forum, (I think here), a gentleman had gotten a bunch of raws and JPGs with SOOC filenames in a jumbled mess. Lr mistakenly interpeted them as paired. But these were completely different images, that had the same names when the camera sequence rolled over. Rare, and one-off, but no practical way to fix it with out starting over.

2) I've uncovered no practical way to back out of the arrangement later. *If there is a reasonable way, I'm interested. This issue comes up often enough.
 
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Mark Sirota;48'49 said:
It's actually a good thing.

The reason LR tries to pair up files with the same name and differing extensions is so that if you move or rename them, they all get moved or rename together. Since these JPEGs are derivatives of the DNG with the same name, you'd proabably want that to happen, right?
Click to expand...


Actually, no. After I'd sent off the jpegs, I planned to delete them!
 
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Agree with Mark on this. Looking at the screen shot you posted (thanks) the pairs are in the same folder. Could you have exported them twice??
 
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I can only assume that you and Mark are right Geoff, and that I exported them to the same folder. It's still annoying that xmp files have been created without my asking!
 
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[quote author=Mark Sirota link=topic=7'5'.msg48'49#msg48'49 date=124638'441]
It's actually a good thing.

The reason LR tries to pair up files with the same name and differing extensions is so that if you move or rename them, they all get moved or rename together. Since these JPEGs are derivatives of the DNG with the same name, you'd proabably want that to happen, right?
[/quote]It is not a good thing. (On another thread) I unchecked the option "Treat JPEG files next to raw files as separate photos." After importing with the option above unchecked, the Lightroom Library shows one image for each file. and it is labeled <filename>.DNG+JPEG. I can not touch the JPEGs inside LR. I can not print the, crop them or doo anything else. I can't even delete them outside KR without complaints from LR about missing sidecar files. My JPEGs are not Lightroom derivatives, they were created by the camera using the camera processor. Often they are good enough to stand alone with perhaps a judicious crop.

I need an easy way to reject both DNG and JPEG that are an imported pair and subsequently delete them with one operation. Someone in this forum suggested suggested unchecking the option to have LR treat them together so that I could reject and delete the set. While that works, it renders the JPEG unaccessable in LR. Another option that I have tried is to stack them after import (LR does not like a ''' sec offset time BTW) If I do that, I can only flag the top image in the stack as rejected and only it gets deleted.
 
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