Catalog and photo files.

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Blade1024

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Guys,

I really like Lightroom and I'm trying to put all pictures together to summ it up and make Lightroom the only editing/printing program. There are couple things I didn't get or need clarification on:
1) Catalog is prepared view of what you actually see in the Library with contain cache as the rest of the stuff, correct?
2) I prefer to work with the RAW NEF files, but I don't see it actually syncing settings that I developed into the files themselves. How can I do that?
3) It might happen that the Q2, I asked, is related to that, but anyways. What is the advantage of using DNG over NEF?

Cheers Mat
 
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1) Could you rephrase this? I can't understand your question

2) By default, Lightroom does not store your edits, nor your metadata, with the photos. You can turn on an option that makes it automatic — but even then, this information is not placed "into the files themselves". The information would be stored in a sidecar .xmp file. The option you want is Edit->Catalog Settings->Metadata, then select "Automatically .... " Please understand ... this stores SOME information in the sidecar file; there is other information in the Lightroom database that is NEVER stored with the files.

3) DNG represents your image with different internal file structure. It is the exact same image. A key difference between DNG and RAW is that the xmp information is stored in the DNG file itself, but in a sidecar .xmp file with RAW photos. There are other advantages and disadvantages here, there are many threads you can read on this.
 
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Mat, welcome. I see that Paige and I were answering simultaneously.....
1) Yes.
2) The adjustments and metadata changes/additions are stored in the *.LRCAT database file, always. You can optionally store most* of the data with the images files. In the case of RGB filetypes, (JPG, TIF, PSD), these file formats are standardized, and the data is embedded in the image file. In the case of raw types, for DNGs, these are also standardized, and the data is embedded. For camera raw types, such as your NEFs, these are proprietary, and it is deemed not good practice to write to them, therefore the data is stored in a linked companion file called a 'sidecar' file, of type XMP.

You enable this saving to the files, either manually by selecting the target photos and pressing ctrl-S, or choosing the Save Metadata option from either the main or various context menus. You can enable the saving globally, per catalog, in the Edit > Catalog Settings menu item.

3) Yes, DNG vs NEF(CR2, etc.) is related to the issue as noted above, the difference is primarily in the file details, and not the end effect. The (dis?)advantages of DNG vs NEF are debated ad infinitum. It's a 'religious war'. There are some practical aspects, and some long term data preservation aspects, and vociferous opinions abound, everybody's an expert. Principally, DNG provides a slightly smaller file, and is capable of maintaining LR adjustments, etc, in the same physical file with the image data. What you potentially give up for this advantage is, as I said, much discussed.


*data not stored in external XMP format is discussed here: http://blogs.oreilly.com/lightroom/2''8/12/xmp-sidecar-files---whats-miss.html
 
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Gentlemen,

Thank you very much for answering.
1) Okay, clear. So backups have to be dualfolded (data and catalog).
2) Then, not taking into account religious wars, DNG will be more preferable because if the XML data is being saved there then it will be backed up along side of it. I also acually found that metadata and embedded JPG have to be regenerated to allow adjustments visibility in regular explorer. Wonderful!
3) Perfect

One last question: Is there a tool from Adobe that will allow me to convert NEF's into the DNG's in mass-scale basis?

Thanks a ton again!

Cheers
 
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While I am glad to see the answer to #1 is "Yes" (thanks, Brad!) I still would like to see the question rephrased, as I don't understand the question itself, and I would like to understand the discussion here.

"DNG will be more preferable because if the XML data is being saved there" — I think this is a DISadvantage of DNG, but I understand that some people think it is an advantage. " ... then it will be backed up along side of it" Any backup strategy would take into account if there are .xmp files and create backups of those as well, so I can't agree with the backup portion of your comment either.
 
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Paige, I gave #1 the liberal interpretation of meaning 'All that image stuff is stored in the catalog, right?" Mat, if you meant something different from that, speak up.

Mat, look at http://www.adobe.com/support/downloads/detail.jsp?ftpID=4679 Adobe's standalone DNG Converter. That's the link for the Windows version, as that's what's listed in your user profile.
 
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Gentlemen,

No, perfect clarification. I was more of into what, where and what thing. I use to have a bunch of negatives and have tonns of IT expirience, so I just had a bit of a trouble glueing it all together. ;-)
The link from Adobe, actually, did the job:
http://livedocs.adobe.com/en_US/Lightroom/1.'/WSC4746647-481'-425e-B6E5-829A'BDABDC9.html

About second one - DNG .vs. NEF. I know it's a personal thing and some people just don't want negatives to be adjusted in any way, but I will just have to try it. I have a home SuSe-based server with the raid on it and I'm backing it up to my work on a daily basis, so pulling additional M's of TIFF is not that advantageous.

My only wish is that Adobe will actually recognise Linux and port LR onto it, but then MAC will die ;-)

Thank you for the explanation, push into the right direction and contravertary opinions.

Cheers Mat
 
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About second one - DNG .vs. NEF. I know it's a personal thing and some people just don't want negatives to be adjusted in any way
Click to expand...
DNGs are negatives and are RAW Files. FWIW, there are at least 12 camera manufacturers that write DNG in the camera. These include Pentax and Leica. The difference between DNG and formats like NEF or CR2 is that DNG is a "Public" published format (not an Open format although some are confused to think so.) Those from Canon and Nikon are "Private" proprietary formats subject to change without notice. There is nothing magical about a DNG or an NEF for that matter, both are extensions of the TIFF/EP6 standard. Both are compressed and both are mosaiced. (Although the DNG can be uncompressed and de-mosaiced and still be a DNG).
 
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[quote author=Blade1'24 link=topic=9639.msg65137#msg65137 date=1271954'53]
One last question: Is there a tool from Adobe that will allow me to convert NEF's into the DNG's in mass-scale basis?
[/quote]

From Lightroom itself select all those you want to convert, go to Menu, Library, Convert Photos to DNG...

This has the advantage of keeping all links to your photos and at the same time, you are offered to keep or detele the raw files once converted.
 
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