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2015.2/6.2 feedback to Adobe

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Does anyone from Adobe ever respond to the issues raised in the forums. I have quickly scanned down the woeful list, but nothing from them?
 
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Adobe makes a good point, the original import dialog was pretty unfriendly and designed by an engineer twenty years ago and just kept adding to it. So a fresh start to it was the right idea, but the implementation they have chosen sucks. It has pissed me off enough and to me likely foretells the future enough, that I started looking last night for a replacement for LightRoom.

But they did not touch base with the existing LightRoom community and it shows. Even the replies on the blog post are negative.

Tim
 
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I think Adobe made two mistakes. The first mistake is that they didn't think about their existing user base, and just dropped several features that photographers tend to use daily. There is simply no excuse for that. The second mistake is that they still went for a 'one fits all' solution: they designed a new, simplified interface with only an 'Advanced' option to hide a few things from novice users. Again there is no excuse for that. You can't make one interface that fits selfie-shooters as well as professional photographers. What they should have done is make an 'Import Assistant'. A possibility to let Lightroom guide you through the import procedure step by step. The new 'Add Photos' screen looks like the first step of such an assistant, but that's it. After that first step you're on your own again, so I really doubt that novice users find this easy to use.
 
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That blog post says that they'll fix the crashing and performance problems, but it says nothing about restoring the removed functionality. Even their apologists don't seem to be listening.

Johan is right: the new interface won't be any more friendly to naive users than the old one, and perhaps less friendly. I'd love to see Adobe just throw this one away and go back to the old one until they can get a top-notch interface designer to come up with something that is really better for both newbies and expert users.
 
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Victoria Bampton said:
Like this, you mean? http://adobe.ly/1hcSBtP
Click to expand...

EXACTLY. That would be much better than the present half-baked approach! Such an assistant would be something a newbie would understand, while at the same time the experienced users could continue to have their familiar old style import dialog.

BTW, Adobe says they had lots of positive feedback. They obviously would never admit that everybody hates it, but it's easy to get 'positive' feedback by carefully phrasing your questions. The best (and very funny) example I ever heard is the following: Researchers went into a church, and asked the people the following question: "Do you think it's acceptable when somebody smokes while praying?". As you can imaging, almost 100% replied that this is not acceptable. Then they asked a similar group of church-goers this question: "Do you think it's acceptable that somebody says a prayer while he's smoking?". This time almost everybody replied that this is quite acceptable...
 
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JohanElzenga said:
BTW, Adobe says they had lots of positive feedback.
Click to expand...

You mean where the post says "We’ve heard great feedback on the changes"? I'd say it was badly worded. It could also be read as "we've heard lots of helpful feedback on the changes", referring to the very vocal thread. And no, I'm not sure which version of understanding was intended either!
 
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Where did you get that wizard?

Victoria Bampton said:
Like this, you mean? http://adobe.ly/1hcSBtP
Click to expand...

Victoria. That is what should have been done. Did you make that up or did you pull that from one of your buddies at Adobe? Things are looking up!

Thanks for all of your honest and straight forward help. I have directed many of my Lightroom students to your site to get them back to 6.1.1 and has been very helpful.

Thank you,

Joe
 
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It is interesting to watch the responses to the change in the Import UI. Ninety five percent seem to be in the category of "The sky is falling, the sky is falling.". The initial "discussion" has become pretty much a "mosh pit" of complaining. Not very useful to anyone IMHO of course. I tried to add two specific requests to add the Move back and the file rename preview. However, these were instantly merged into the mosh pit topic and virtually lost by now.

The really big problem with this release is the application crashes and that thanks to Victoria's warning I have kept me away from this release until that is fixed.

I have always felt that the old Import UI was pretty clunky and it never really gave me the options that I wanted. To that end I am stilling Image Ingester Pro as a front end to do most of the heavy lifting of renaming and adding basic metadata and only using Import to update my catalog with the new images. I will have to reserve judgment on the new UI until the time I actually upgrade.

It seems to me that one of the underlying problems here is the architecture of Lightroom it self. This has become notable with the recent influx of Aperture users. There has been an endless stream posts on this site from poor people getting all confused about catalogs and where are my images and why did all my images disappear when I moved them in Finder/Explorer. Lightroom itself requires a certain level of computer system knowledge that many people simply do not have and the learning curve has been painful for them.

I thank that the update to the Import UI as a genuine attempt by Adobe to help rectify this situation.


-louie
 
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Bob Peters said:
The arrogance of that Adobe response is astounding! It sounds like they got some volunteers off the street and asked them to make sense of Lightroom. Good luck with that, Adobe.
Click to expand...

Take the concept further to the develop module. :)
This is why I am now looking for a replacement.

Tim
 
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Im a new user to Lightroom and I totally disagree with the assertion from Adobe that the import screen is confusing and difficult. Admittedly I have been using time spent after an operation productively to learn the system, but following Victoria Bramptons excellent guide for new starters within a week I have managed to import photos from multiple sources including iPhoto (rubbish), Elements (OK but complicated file handling) and direct from iPhone into fully comprehensible and searchable file date based structure, keyword over half of them, rate them all, learn how to use the gradient filters in develop, tart up some images etc etc. Im not a luddite but am not far short of it - to me all it requires is some research, a bit of trial and error, a willingness to learn and above all time and concentration.

I moved away from Apples own photography software precisely because each iteration was dumbed down further, never seemed to be tested properly and locked you into their own system for ever - its really depressing that Adobe seems to be following a similar path.
 
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Bob Peters said:
The arrogance of that Adobe response is astounding! It sounds like they got some volunteers off the street and asked them to make sense of Lightroom. Good luck with that, Adobe.
Click to expand...

... and the test department has been replaced with beta testers = you..... Its brilliant. They get license money + free beta testers. Great....
Well, I considered to move from LR 6 to CC. But now... Never! Lightroom has to stay in version 6.1 for me. As long as it can. (I wish I didn't upgrade from 5.7 in the first place)
 
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JohanElzenga said:
I think Adobe made two mistakes. The first mistake is that they didn't think about their existing user base, and just dropped several features that photographers tend to use daily. There is simply no excuse for that. The second mistake is that they still went for a 'one fits all' solution: they designed a new, simplified interface with only an 'Advanced' option to hide a few things from novice users. Again there is no excuse for that. You can't make one interface that fits selfie-shooters as well as professional photographers. What they should have done is make an 'Import Assistant'. A possibility to let Lightroom guide you through the import procedure step by step. The new 'Add Photos' screen looks like the first step of such an assistant, but that's it. After that first step you're on your own again, so I really doubt that novice users find this easy to use.
Click to expand...
I think this is a good summary. There are now two recent instances where Adobe has releases a poorly tested product to the general public. (6.0 & 6.2) Adobe needs to do more to correct that flaw in their rollout procedure. And they need to do that quickly if they want to retain the existing customer base. I don't want to use a product unless it has been thoroughly tested. If Adobe Sales and Marketing thinks it critical that a product like 6.2 be timed to release in conjunction with a Sales event (Adobe Max), they need to recognize that the sales reaction will be a poor one if the product released is seriously flawed.
Adobe said earlier that they will not provide any feature updates for LR6, and that new features would show up only for cloud license subscription customers until the next full release of the perpetual license version. This was the Adobe talking point on De-haze. All of the perpetual License user were clamoring for Dehaze to be included in 6.1. No one would be disappointed if 6.2 did not include a new Import interface. Even existing subscription users could live without a new import interface. Yet Adobe crammed through this update without telling any subscribers that it included new and not fully tested functionality.
Why did Adobe change this policy for Perpetual license holders for 6.2 And can anyone tell me if the Perpetual license version of 6.2 now includes the full screen dehaze and the local dehaze. IOW Has Adobe reversed it policy to not add new functionality with perpetual license versions?
 
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clee01l said:
Why did Adobe change this policy for Perpetual license holders for 6.2 And can anyone tell me if the Perpetual license version of 6.2 now includes the full screen dehaze and the local dehaze. IOW Has Adobe reversed it policy to not add new functionality with perpetual license versions?
Click to expand...

The short answer is that they haven't changed their policy. The new import is not a new feature, it's a change to an existing feature and so can be included in both "versions" without the accounting policies getting in the way.
 
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FWIW I responded to the blog post put out by Adobe:
I made it clear that I felt that Adobe's "solution" to a perceived issue with the Import dialog by removing useful functionality was poorly conceived.
I also made the point that attempting to placate new users by alienating established users was a very poor business strategy.
Perhaps, for me, even more annoying was Adobe releasing a buggy update prematurely, just for the sake of marketing!

Putting my cards on the table: I really rate Lightroom as an indispensable tool in my photographic workflow. Lightroom has never been "perfect" in an absolute sense - all of us are aware of shortcomings in the various modules. However, the overall package is unbeatable.
Nonetheless, this latest update is a very unfortunate and disappointingly regressive step for the reasons mentioned above.

My $0.02 worth

Tony Jay
 
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I have unchecked the offending preference but a=m still getting problems

Zoom cursor swapped with hand cursor (wrong one at 100%)
Cell view options don't appear or stick
image selected in thumbnails doesn't show for ages
Message box won't go away even if I move the rest of the window away

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Adobe you've got to be kidding. Having totally embraced Lr since beta & V1 and rolled through the progressive updates with mostly enthusiasm and occasional irritation, V6.2 marks a historic low-point. As a PC user I'm not exposed to the grief experienced by OSX El Kapitan users, but the total mis-fire on the removal of key features in the Import dialog is unforgivable. The old Import UI was never going to win design awards but it wasn't exactly rocket science to figure out. And it worked. As a very busy professional, the ill-conceived V6.2 Import fiasco will do nothing but add time, extra steps and creativity sucking irritation. Please restore the lost features immediately.

-pw
 
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pwp said:
Adobe you've got to be kidding. Having totally embraced Lr since beta & V1 and rolled through the progressive updates with mostly enthusiasm and occasional irritation, V6.2 marks a historic low-point. As a PC user I'm not exposed to the grief experience by OSX El Kapitan users, but the total mis-fire on the removal of key features in the Import dialog is unforgivable. The old Import UI was never going to win design awards but it wasn't exactly rocket science to figure out. And it worked. As a very busy professional, the ill-conceived V6.2 Import fiasco will do nothing but add time, extra steps and creativity sucking irritation. Please restore the lost features immediately.

-pw
Click to expand...

Make sure to comment on the Adobe feedback site.
http://feedback.photoshop.com/photoshop_family/topics/new-update-6-2

Since I feel Adobe only really listens to money, and the response they posted said existing customers are worthless, I have canceled my CC plan while I evaluate other software packages. I will continue to hang out and watch to see if Adobe fixes the problems they caused, or if one of the other packages does what I need.

Tim
 
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As I commented on the linked forum, if Adobe doesn't fix this, it's terminal. This as a Lightroom user since version 1.
Bravo to those who cancelled their CC plan. If I could demand a refund for my purchase of LR6(even tho 6.2 is the problem), I would.
 
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