"From Lr mobile" collections bug?

[DaveHeisley]

Lightroom Version Number

Classic 12.1 release

Operating System

1. macOS 13 Ventura

This is really a Cloud/Classic interface question, but since it manifests in Classic, I’ll post here. Sorry the post goes on for so long...
I’m not sure if this is a Bug, an issue with my catalog, or it somehow makes sense but really Bugs me.

Let’s say one of my regular collections generated from Classic folders and sync’d to mobile looks like this:
Collections/YYYY set/Collection L
“Normal behavior” looks like this: in grid view of the collection, all images have Collections icon (double rectangle). Clicking the icon pops up the list of all containing collections.
In grid view of the Classic Folder that contains the image, the image has an icon that displays the same thing (the list of containing collections).

But in collections under “From Lr Mobile”, things are far more mysterious/dumbfounding.
Lets say I start with
Collections/YYYY set/Collection M
In grid view of the collection, NO photos display Collections icon (including the collection they are in, ie: Collection M). Going to the same image in the Classic folder, all show the collection icon and list Collection M “From Lr Collection” album/collection. (From here, M will be shorthand for Collection M).

I now open LR Cloud desktop and generate a new Album from a subset of the original Album that we’ll call collection M Select (since it is top shots I want to share).
Now, back to Classic grid view:
New collection M Select does not show up in the collections list.
Images that are in BOTH collections, M and M Select, have icons that list 2 collections:
Collection M
Collection M Select
However, images that are only in Collection M still show no collection icons.

Weirder, clicking on the collection icon and choosing M results in the appropriate collection name lighting up and the displayed grid of images are all from M. But choosing M Select from the icon list, results in NOTHING lighting up (ie: LR doesn’t seem to know where the collection is), but displays the grid that contains the images in M Select.

Now I CLOSE Cloud desktop. Almost immediately, Collection M Select shows up in the Collections list in Classic. Now, in Collection M:
The images that are in Collection M, but not in Collection M Select still do not show ownership in any collection (no collections icon).
The images that are in both collections (M and M Select) show as belonging to THREE collections:
#1 Collection M Select
#2 Collection M
#3 Collection M Select
Clicking #3 lights up the "Collection M Select" name in the collection list and displays the images in M Select. Clicking #2 lights up/displays Collection M. But clicking #1 again turns off any name lights (but displays images from M Select).

If I go to the Classic folder that contains the images, they all have the collections icon and containing collections are displayed correctly (ie: they show either Collection M or BOTH Collection M and Collection M Select.)

Last test:
Drag an image from a Classic folder to M. No collection icons displayed.
Drag it to M Select (now it is in both M and M Select). The image in both collections displays a collection icon and lists both collections.
Delete the image from EITHER collection, and the image that remains in 1 collection displays no collection icons.

If there is reasoning to this behavior, it is beyond my ken. I believe it is a bug. Looking for confirmation/explanation/corrections...

My use case and background: I’m not a professional photographer, but an enthusiast who travels extensively and often shares my best shots with fellow travelers, as well as often volunteering to collect from my travel group and then generate a curated collection which I then share and occasionally present to a more public audience. Therefore, mobile features have had increasing importance in my workflow and I’m considering the transition to Cloud from Classic. I am currently awkwardly straddling both camps: before my last trip I finally installed LR Cloud desktop and I’m running parallel until I make a final decision. I’ve leaned heavily toward Classic with mobile features, but the Cloud is really coming along and I find I’m hating dealing with the thicket of dual app issues. I’ve found some other issues and have some other questions, but I’ll post those separately.

 

[Jim Wilde]

I confess that I haven't followed all of that, but there's something about collections which you need to know and which might be a contributing factor to your confusion.

Specifically, if you have a folder selected as the source, in grid view the collections icon will be displayed on any image which is contained within any collection (no matter if in the From Mobile collection set or not). And of course clicking on the collection icon will display a list of the containing collections.

But, if you have a single collection selected as the source, the collection icon will only be shown on an image IF that image is also contained in other collections. If the image is ONLY contained within the selected collection, the icon is not displayed.

It's a similar thing if you select a collection SET.....the icon will only show on any images that exist in more than one collection. If the images only exist within one of the collections in the collection set, the icon is not displayed.

Does that help?

 

[DaveHeisley]

Jim, that helped enormously and pretty much answered my 90% of my questions. THANKS! I've looked over other collections and verified the behavior is as you described and I even think it is a semi-reasonable approach (more reasonable would be to plop the icon onto everything that is in any collection, IMHO). Don't know how I haven't noticed it before.

There is still the "phantom collection" issue which I'm pretty sure is a bug, but is not too critical since it only seems to happen when both Classic and Cloud are both open, which I'm reasonably sure is not reasonably good practice. I'll see if I can describe the case and behavior briefly FWIW.

Classic and Cloud Desktop are both open. A new collection containing images that are also in another collection is generated in Cloud Desktop.

1. Classic does not display the new collection name until Cloud is closed.
2. However, Classic is AWARE of the collection before Desktop is closed because all the images that are now in 2 collections have icons.
3. Clicking on the icon lists 2 collections: the original and the new. Selecting the new collection name will display all the images that are in the new Desktop collection, but because the new collection name has not been turned on in Classic, no name will light up in the list (because its not there).
4. Closing the collection in Cloud Desktop pops the new collection name into Classics list of collections.
5. But now there are 3 names in the icon list:
   1. New collection created before the name existed in Classic (the Zombie)
   2. Original collection
   3. New collection, duplicate name
6. Selecting #3 switches to grid view of New and lights up the name of New. All is well.
7. Selecting #2 switches to grid view of Original and lights up the name of Original. All's well.
8. Selecting #1 switches to grid view containing images in New, but does not light up New collection name. Check mark is on New name #1.

 

[Jim Wilde]

There is still the "phantom collection" issue which I'm pretty sure is a bug, but is not too critical since it only seems to happen when both Classic and Cloud are both open, which I'm reasonably sure is not reasonably good practice. I'll see if I can describe the case and behavior briefly FWIW.

Classic and Cloud Desktop are both open. A new collection containing images that are also in another collection is generated in Cloud Desktop.

1. Classic does not display the new collection name until Cloud is closed.

No reason why you can't have both apps open at the same time on the same system, I will routinely be in that situation. They don't communicate directly with each other, they just happen to share your local network.

How long do you wait for the collection to appear in LrC before you close Lightroom? It's less than 30 seconds on my setup. If this keeps happening, a useful exercise (before closing Lightroom) would be to check if the newly created album appears in any of the other Lightroom apps, e.g. in LrM on your phone or in the LrWeb app in a browser window (login at lightroom.adobe.com). If it does appear there, then the hiccup would be between LrC and the cloud, but if they don't appear there the hiccup would be between Lightroom and the cloud.

It all sounds pretty weird, and I'd be tempted to try resetting the Preferences, probably initially in LrC (but maybe later also in Lightroom). Instructions are here: https://www.lightroomqueen.com/how-do-i-reset-lightrooms-preferences/

 

[DaveHeisley]

Jim, thanks again for your response! Like I say, this looks like a small problem, but I can dig a little further. I’ll try a few experiments and see if I can narrow down the trigger conditions. If I can find the repeatable combo, I’ll try the reset you’ve pointed to and try a repeat again. If the behavior is the same, where should I report to Adobe? I’ll report back here either way.

 

[Jim Wilde]

Jim, thanks again for your response! Like I say, this looks like a small problem, but I can dig a little further. I’ll try a few experiments and see if I can narrow down the trigger conditions. If I can find the repeatable combo, I’ll try the reset you’ve pointed to and try a repeat again. If the behavior is the same, where should I report to Adobe? I’ll report back here either way.

To put in a report to Adobe, use the Bug Report/Feature Request link at the top of any of this forum's pages.