Change capture date without losing edit history

[The Missing Link]

Lightroom Version Number

6.14

Operating System

1. Windows 10

I have many old pictures in my collection that were scanned from paper photographs (upto early 1900). I'd like to properly date these with the estimated date taken. In that field now is often the scanned-date. Is there a way that I can change that date without losing any edits (metadata) in LR? I know it's possible outside LR but then the picture is labeled as "having changed metadata" and I can choose to either discard and keep LR edits or read the new data from the file but lose my LR edits. I guess I need to find a way to do this inside LR.

 

[The Missing Link]

John, I haven't received any emails form you...

 

[The Missing Link]

Again, I apologize for remaining persistent here but I think what I'm looking for should be very interesting to MANY people who scan old pictures.
I'm still hoping that eventually we'll find a solutions here. I'm willing to cooperate through thinking or writing code (e.g. in Excel to provide a list with file name and suggested file date), and even pay for a tool or tool update (if reasonably priced).

 

[The Missing Link]

So what if I change the metadata externally? I know LR will 'see' that and offer to either read the updated metadata (destroying my edit history) or ignore the changes and overwrite with what's in the catalog. Neither will work for me. Is there no way to change what LT stores in the Catalog somehow and then make it 'apply' that?
With the fact that the Search and Replace and LR/Transporter plugins both prove that it can work but regretfully both fail in their implementation somehow I'm still hoping this can be cracked somehow.

 

[Johan Elzenga]

If you first write metadata to files in Lightroom, then edit the xmp files externally, and finally read the metadata from xmp again in Lightroom, then you should not lose your edits. Unless the external editor destroys the edit information in the xmp file, that is.

 

[LexS]

If you first write metadata to files in Lightroom, then edit the xmp files externally, and finally read the metadata from xmp again in Lightroom, then you should not lose your edits. Unless the external editor destroys the edit information in the xmp file, that is.

I would like to add how I do it (not automized):
as quoted above, then saved in LTR, so that the picture has metadat in it;
then I use Exifchanger (in mac) to set all metadata that I like, and save it to the picture,
(In windows one can use ExifTool, but I don't like the user interface),
Edits don't dissapear that way (at least I did not notice).

 

[The Missing Link]

If you first write metadata to files in Lightroom, then edit the xmp files externally, and finally read the metadata from xmp again in Lightroom, then you should not lose your edits. Unless the external editor destroys the edit information in the xmp file, that is.

Regretfully my files are TIF or JPG... no XMP sidecars there...

 

[The Missing Link]

I would like to add how I do it (not automized):
as quoted above, then saved in LTR, so that the picture has metadat in it;
then I use Exifchanger (in mac) to set all metadata that I like, and save it to the picture,
(In windows one can use ExifTool, but I don't like the user interface),
Edits don't dissapear that way (at least I did not notice).

That's my point... AFAIK and have tried, LR 'sees' the external changes and makes you choose: dicard the external changes or read the new (changed) file. The latter removes edit history

 

[Johan Elzenga]

That's my point... AFAIK and have tried, LR 'sees' the external changes and makes you choose: dicard the external changes or read the new (changed) file. The latter removes edit history

You are talking about 'edit history', so just to be clear: Do you claim that the edits themselves are lost, or just the entries in the edit history panel? I can't reproduce either, but I can understand that you would lose the edits themselves if the external editor removes those.

Regretfully my files are TIF or JPG... no XMP sidecars there...

That is irrelevant. TIF and JPEG store the edits in the metadata header of the file itself, not in a separate xmp file, but that doesn't make a difference.

 

[The Missing Link]

You are talking about 'edit history', so just to be clear: Do you claim that the edits themselves are lost, or just the entries in the edit history panel? I can't reproduce either, but I can understand that you would lose the edits themselves if the external editor removes those.


That is irrelevant. TIF and JPEG store the edits in the metadata header of the file itself, not in a separate xmp file, but that doesn't make a difference.

On the XMP comment John: you said "if you first write metadata to files in Lightroom, then edit the xmp files externally, and finally read the metadata from xmp again in Lightroom, then you should not lose your edits. Unless the external editor destroys the edit information in the xmp file, that is. "
All I'm indicating is that I use TIF / JPG and therefore I have no XMP files, I know that info is in the header, but an XMP is 'readable' (and thus easily editable), a binary header is not.

On your remark about edit-history, I mean that the history is gone, not the edits (that is: you get the edited picture with no way to revert changes).

I'm not saying I'm right, I'm saying that this is what I'm seeing (actually, I hope you are right as that might help solve my problem )

 

[Johan Elzenga]

On the XMP comment John: you said "if you first write metadata to files in Lightroom, then edit the xmp files externally, and finally read the metadata from xmp again in Lightroom, then you should not lose your edits. Unless the external editor destroys the edit information in the xmp file, that is. "
All I'm indicating is that I use TIF / JPG and therefore I have no XMP files, I know that info is in the header, but an XMP is 'readable' (and thus easily editable), a binary header is not.

That does not change anything I said. What applies to xmp files, applies to metadata in a file header as well. And there are lots of metadata editors that can read/write the metadata in tif/jeg just fine.

On your remark about edit-history, I mean that the history is gone, not the edits (that is: you get the edited picture with no way to revert changes).

I'm not saying I'm right, I'm saying that this is what I'm seeing (actually, I hope you are right as that might help solve my problem)

That is strange, because the edit history is not written to xmp (or metadata written to tiff/jpg) at all. Reading these metadata should therefor not delete the edit history, for the same reason. And it doesn’t when I try it, but I haven’t tried it for tiff/jpg, only for raw files. As I am typing this on my iPad, I can’t try it right now.

 

[PhilBurton]

I would like to add how I do it (not automized):
as quoted above, then saved in LTR, so that the picture has metadat in it;
then I use Exifchanger (in mac) to set all metadata that I like, and save it to the picture,
(In windows one can use ExifTool, but I don't like the user interface),
Edits don't dissapear that way (at least I did not notice).

To clarify your post, you first write all metadata out to XMP sidecars. Then you use the Exifchanger tool to change just the dates. Does Exifchanger show the metadata related to edits? When you then read metadata back in to Lightroom, the edit history is preserved? Yes? No?

Phil

 

[The Missing Link]

That does not change anything I said. What applies to xmp files, applies to metadata in a file header as well. And there are lots of metadata editors that can read/write the metadata in tif/jeg just fine.


That is strange, because the edit history is not written to xmp (or metadata written to tiff/jpg) at all. Reading these metadata should therefor not delete the edit history, for the same reason. And it doesn’t when I try it, but I haven’t tried it for tiff/jpg, only for raw files. As I am typing this on my iPad, I can’t try it right now.

OK, thanks, let me find some time to try everything again, maybe I've been doing things wrong.

 

[Johan Elzenga]

Well, I just tried save metadata to file, and then read metadata from file, on a tiff. No problems with the edit history. I can only conclude that the metadata editor that you use must cause this problem somehow.

 

[Johan Elzenga]

Come to think of it: what you describe sounds very much like you are reimporting. If you save metadata to files, remove the files from the catalog, and then reimport them again, then you will retain edits and other metadata, but you will lose the edit history.